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Re: [Ayatana] Epiphany as a desktop-consistent web browser in Ubuntu
On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 11:15 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote:
> Aren't we after the application selection stage? Any change would have
> to be 10.10 +1
Well we are but id say if there was something important that was missed
im sure the desktop team would want to talk about it.
I mentioned Epiphany and Midori in the default app selection meeting but
there is some serious issues with both Epiphany and Midori. The main
issues with both of them is support, Epiphany supports third party
plugins but they dont have nowhere near as many as Firefox and Chromium
and Midori last time I checked has no such system. They all use webkit
except Firefox but Chromium has some extra stuff in there like each tab
running in separate processes.
Although Epiphany is very well integrated in the desktop it still looks
and feels bad to use and Chromium is very well integrated with the look
and feel of Gnome desktop.
Anyway all that being said this conversation should be happening on the
desktop team mailing list. They would have a much better answer for you
than I would and this is kinda out of spec for Ayatana.
>
> On May 17, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Jeremy Nickurak <jeremy@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > You certainly point out a few of those "rough edges" :) I'd simply
> > argue that they're relatively small. If epiphany was to be targetted
> > as a default browser for 10.10 (for example), we'd find a lot more
> > of these rough-edges, get more usability testing results, get more
> > developer eyeballs and keyboards on it, and ultimately get a better
> > web experience for everyone (IMO :) )
> >
> > AFAIK, this is approximately the same argument that was made for
> > pulseaudio, and (although it took several releases to get it to a
> > good state) I think it's been a huge net win overall.
> >
> > On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 11:26, Krzysztof Klimonda
> > <kklimonda@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 10:24 -0600, Jeremy Nickurak wrote:
> > (...)
> > Hey,
> > > Epiphany provides a web browser experience that's much
> > more consistent
> > > with the rest of the gtk/gnome desktop environment. It has
> > a few rough
> > > edges, but the 2.30.x branch has made some HUGE leaps in
> > terms of
> > > usability and website compatability, via the webkit-gtk
> > project.
> >
> > Although I agree that Epiphany is a better choice for a
> > GNOME browser as
> > it integrates well with the platform (for example using
> > gnome-keyring
> > for storing passwords) its rough edges make it hard to use
> > it and there
> > are few other things we should think about.
> > My biggest issue with Epiphany is the way it handles tabs -
> > they were
> > the most important selling point of the Firefox, Google has
> > done a lot
> > of work on their implementation to make sure it's great but
> > Epiphany
> > uses a default toolkit tabs which simply do not cut it - I
> > can open only
> > 8 tabs on my laptop without them being hidden and useless
> > button popping
> > out. I can open 14 tabs on Firefox before I get those
> > "scrolling
> > buttons" (and I always access a list of all opened tab in a
> > form of
> > dropdown menu) and even more on Chromium.
> > While I agree that unexperienced users don't really care
> > about tabs, I
> > must say that for all the others the ability to manage a lot
> > of tabs is
> > important.
> >
> > Another issue related to tabs and opening new window is that
> > the url bar
> > isn't focused - I have to press ctrl+l/F6 every time to
> > start typing
> > url.
> >
> > Both Firefox and Chromium provide way of installing
> > 3rd-party plugins
> > (or add-ons) for your browser directly from web pages.
> >
> > >
> > > Epiphany also might yield better results than other
> > browsers like
> > > Firefox and Chrome, which use relatively heavyweight
> > custom toolkits
> > > and widgets. I get the impression that integrating
> > Epiphany into newer
> > > ubuntu design goals (global menu, windicator, etc) would
> > be
> > > substantially less work.
> >
> > Probably. It uses GTK+ and Firefox uses XUL so Epiphany does
> > look like
> > an easier target to at least implement global menu (it
> > should just
> > work).
> >
> > >
> > > As someone who's successfully switched to using epiphany
> > for about 99%
> > > of my browsing, my experience can't help but ask if
> > epiphany is the
> > > best route going forward. Is it getting much attention
> > from Ayatana?
> >
> > What about other 1%? :)
> >
> > I like Epiphany and I believe that Ubuntu needs a browser
> > that is
> > visually and technically integrated with the rest of the
> > desktop. I
> > don't believe that Epiphany is there yet, though. The cost
> > of switching
> > for many users would be just too big and the gain from
> > switching isn't
> > obvious for most of them. I think that working on getting
> > Firefox (or
> > even better Chromium) more integrated with GNOME may be an
> > easier and
> > safer route.
> >
> > Best Regards,
> > --
> > Krzysztof Klimonda <kklimonda@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jeremy Nickurak -= Email/XMPP: jeremy@xxxxxxxxxxx =-
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Post to : ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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> >
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