elementary-dev-community team mailing list archive

[Daniel Foré <daniel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I'm not opposed to being a bit "radical" and stealing lp:music while its up for grabs, ha!

We could change the strings to read like "Your library has been imported" or "Your library cannot be found" instead of saying Music can't find it. But, like you said this still creates work for translators. 

I'm also not opposed to the implication of limiting the feature set. There's so much we could do just in the realm of only music with this app that I'm not concerned about the app being barren of features, and I do relieve that Audience is just going to be a better video player and its very possible a dedicated podcast app could work a lot better than lumping those in as well.

I'm +1 to whatever you decide Victor. But it sounds like we're leaning toward going with Music ha

Best Regards,
Daniel Foré

El nov 21, 2012, a las 6:50 p.m., Victor Eduardo <victor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> escribió:

> I like the direction this is taking, and I also agree with simply naming the application "Music". Your arguments are also coherent with those found in the comments of the Geary Naming thread. Some thoughts:
> 
> L10n and i18n
> 
> The only thing I don't like about using a generic name for an application like Noise is that it implies modifying a lot of strings. Strings like the following would no longer be valid:
> Music cannot find your music folder.
> Music has imported your library.
> Etcetera...
> Currently, Noise uses a '%s' on the obliqued words above (Music), and translators can confirm that you'd rarely see the word "Noise" in a translatable string.  Therefore, moving to a different non-generic name would not destroy the current translations, because the majority of strings containing the app's name would be kept untouched.
> 
> I guess that when using a generic name, replacing the application's name by "We" or "I" is enough for English, but it would probably be a bit more complicated for translators on languages in which using impersonal expressions is not the preferred style.[Translators' input needed]
> 
> Feature Set
> 
> Using Music as the new name would also limit the set of features we could target to the application. While the new name would leave a chance for Internet radio (which is a planned feature and fits well into the music player), it would also imply no podcasts, etc. I am personally against integrating podcasts into the music player anyway; Feedler + Audience could do a great job on that area.
> 
> 
> In general, we could gain a lot in terms of app discoverability by using a generic name. For example, there would be no need to tell your grandma what the application does, because the icon plus the name would make it pretty obvious. We wouldn't be forcing an English name either, and this would be loved by our international user base. 
> 
> In the cons side, arguments against the generic name would be the big amount of work it would create for translators, and the fact that some people consider generic default applications to be crappy (you can disregard this; I have no proofs). Of course the latter is not a problem as long as we manage to get major bugs fixed and keep high quality standards. Also, the app looks great, so I don't worry much about it.
> 
> My last questions:
> Do we have green light to start working on the rename (to Music)?
> What would be the new name on Launchpad? Pantheon Music? I'd personally prefer elementary Music, but that would create inconsistency. http://launchpad.net/music is also available, in case we're being radical.
> 
> Thanks in advance for your replies.
> 
> Sincerely,
> Victor.
> 
> On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Uday Shankar <udayonze@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> I agree with this. Simplicity is what has drawn me to elementary. Let music be music what more? :-) no offense 
>> 
>> Sent from my Windows Phone
>> From: Cassidy James
>> Sent: 11/21/2012 12:01 PM
>> To: Cody Garver
>> Cc: xapantu; elementary-dev-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: [Elementary-dev-community] Renaming Noise
>> 
>> 
>> Music gets a +1 from me as well. Honestly, I think that we either need to keep it Noise or rename it to Music. Changing the name to anything else really seems unnecessary at this point.
>> 
>> Regarding the generic name thing, I think that's something we should decide on a per-app basis. Technically its generic name would be "Music Player" but its app name would just be "Music". We can't just show genetic names for the apps in the launcher by default, so this is probably the best route and is what we've been doing with apps like Terminal and Files.
>> 
>> Again, I'm not opposed to Noise, but if we do change it, I think it should just be Music.
>> 
>> Regards, 
>> Cassidy James
>> 
>> On Nov 20, 2012 3:18 PM, "Cody Garver" <cody@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> I'm for Music. I also think music is what development should center around and leave podcasts and maybe even radio to separate apps. Podcasts because they really need a store experience, otherwise you'd be better off just subscribing to them in an RSS aggregator. 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Nov 20, 2012, at 3:05 PM, "Daniel Foré" <daniel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> 
>>> Just my two cents:
>>> 
>>> It'd be really easy to just call it "Music" and not worry about it any longer haha.
>>> 
>>> I don't think we should translate the name unless we're going with "Music". Translating a "branded" name would kind of defeat the purpose, IMO and (as previously pointed out) could lead to some not-so-nice translations.
>>> 
>>> I didn't really intend Noise to be a serious name, but I don't have any massive problems with it either. I do agree with Victor that if we're going to do a name change it needs to happen as soon as humanly possible.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 10:56 AM, Jose Luis Navarro <jlnavarro111@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> @Victor +1
>>> 
>>> El 19/11/2012 19:42, "xapantu" <xapantu@xxxxxxxxx> escribió:
>>> 
>>> Le 19/11/2012 17:43, Benjamin VanMeggelen a écrit :
>>>> I understand the issue with the translation. >>From what I understand (as french being my second language) the translation from Noise to french is Bruit. I'm not sure if the application titles have been (or will be) translated, but if  so "Bruit" gives the same proper description of what Noise is in english.
>>> I hope it doesn't, IIRC "bruit" is much more negative than noise. "bruit" is just something you don't want to hear, when you say music is "bruit", it means that the music is very, very bad. And no, the names aren't (or shouldn't?) be translated ;)
>>> (But as Corentin said, "noise" is not much better than "bruit" is french anyway.)
>>> 
>>> Lucas
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, 19 Nov, 2012 at 11:38 AM, Corentin Noël <tintou@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>> Okay, I disagree with you all then because in my language (french) there is two way to pronounce that :
>>>>> In french, and that word exists and means "problems"
>>>>> In english, and that is really hard because there is an double voyel (no-ise) so it's not that good for us.
>>>>> I let the democracy choose, but here are my two cents.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Corentin Noël (tintou)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Benjamin VanMeggelen a écrit :
>>>>> 
>>>>> >I also agree that Noise is an appropriate name for the player. I feel that this naming scheme is most relevant to the player, as opposed to Tempo or some of the others that have been mentioned. Noise seems more generic and straight-forward as to what the app is meant to do.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >On Mon, 19 Nov, 2012 at 9:51 AM, Felix Akkermans wrote:
>>>>> >I also agree with Jaap. Both names are equal to me in communicational value, so definitely not worth the effort and hassle.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >On 11/19/2012 03:46 PM, Chris Triantafillis wrote:
>>>>> >I agree with Jaap and i'm against rename it...
>>>>> >Also i don't like Tempo, Noise is much better...
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >2012/11/19 Jaap Broekhuizen 
>>>>> >Don't we already present Noise in the OS as a music player? Doesn't the icon have the purpose of showing the user what the app probably does?
>>>>> >
>>>>> >IMO "Noise" relates more to music than "Tempo" does. Also, if we are going this way with Noise because the name should directly show people what the app does, we should probably rename Geary and Midori too. And the makers of Empathy, Skype, Spotify, Steam, Firefox, Opera, Launchpad, Google Plus, Banshee, Clementine should probably have to start to think about a new name too.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >When we moved from Beatbox to our own fork the choice was made to name it "Noise". That already resulted in some confusion among the users. Renaming it again will only yet again result in more confusion.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >There will always be people who say a certain name is not good for the app, or that it is weird. The same will happen when you rename it to "Tempo", or any other name for that matter. 
>>>>> >
>>>>> >IMO Noise should only be renamed if there is a really, really good reason to, and some users complaining it may sound negative is a good reason, i think. Also when you choose to rename it, the new name should be significantly better than the old name, if you want to show the confused users that it was really necessary and useful to make the change.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >Just my two cents,
>>>>> >Jaap
>>>>> >
>>>>> >Op ma, nov 19, 2012 at 3:14 ,David Gomes schreef:
>>>>> >
>>>>> >It's trivial to you because you know what Noise is. It's a media player, you know it.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >For people who don't, it's better if that name it is installed under in the computer is "Music Player" or something like that. It's easier for most people.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Jaap Broekhuizen | Mobiel wrote:
>>>>> >What is "many"? Seems like a trivial thing to me...
>>>>> >
>>>>> >--
>>>>> >Jaap
>>>>> >
>>>>> >"Sergey "Shnatsel" Davidoff" schreef:
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>2012/11/19 Jaap Broekhuizen :
>>>>> >>> Is there an actual logical reason to rename Noise?
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>"Noise" is perceived as something negative by many (the kind of people
>>>>> >>who are not crazy about metal or industrial), that's it AFAIK.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>--
>>>>> >>Sergey "Shnatsel" Davidoff
>>>>> >>OS architect @ elementary
>>>>> >--
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>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >-- 
>>>>> >Best Regards, 
>>>>> >Chris Triantafillis
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >-- 
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>>> 
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>>> -- 
>>> Best Regards,
>>> 
>>> Daniel Foré
>>> 
>>> elementaryos.org
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