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Message #27667
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
On 2/7/2017 11:42 AM, Jon Evans wrote:
> I can think of a few ways to approach it:
>
> 1) Don't change how color works in the UI of pcbnew for now. Change to
> wxColour under the hood, but keep the current color selections -- no
> user visible change, no problems, but also no new feature in pcbnew GAL.
>
> 2) Allow using the new color picker in GAL canvas of pcbnew. When user
> changes from legacy to GAL, no problem. When user changes from GAL to
> legacy, now there is the question of what to do. We could:
>
> 2a) Reset layer colors to the legacy defaults
Probably the safest bet albeit annoying for users who switch between
canvases.
> 2b) Set layer colors to the "closest" legacy default to what the user
> set in GAL (how to define "closest" requires some testing I think) --
> optionally give a notice to the user that their colors have been
> modified because of the switch to legacy.
I don't know how successfully you will be able to choose the nearest
color and still have the legacy canvas look reasonable. There may be a
way to test this but it could be tricky. This would be my preference if
it can be implemented correctly.
> 2c) Warn the user that they have changed to colors that won't work right
> in legacy canvas, and advise them to manually reset their layer colors.
> Things will look weird until the user does so.
Please under no circumstances should we be popping up warning dialogs
between canvas switches. That would be really annoying.
>
> Any preference for the above?
>
> -Jon
>
> On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 11:20 AM, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>
> I'm not sure how you would prevent "bad" legacy colors from being
> selected without limiting the color selection in the gal canvas. If you
> can pull it off without the code limiting colors in gal, still be useful
> in legacy, and have a reasonable design than I'm OK with it. Given that
> we are nearing a feature freeze for the next stable release, if you
> cannot have this ready reasonably soon (next month or two), then it will
> have to be pushed back to the version 6 release.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Wayne
>
> On 2/7/2017 10:27 AM, Jon Evans wrote:
> > Would you accept the patch to move to wxColour if it were not possible
> > to choose "bad" colors in the the layout tool? It would be easy to
> > restrict the colors to the current set in the pcb/footprint editors and
> > just allow user selection in the schematic/symbol editors for now.
> >
> > On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 10:19 AM, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>
> > <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
> >
> > On 2/7/2017 9:00 AM, Chris Pavlina wrote:
> > > On Tue, Feb 07, 2017 at 08:57:23AM -0500, Jon Evans wrote:
> > >> Hi Simon, JP,
> > >>
> > >> I understand the issue with the colors chosen for OR-mixing. I thought a
> > >> good first step would be to set the framework for the future when that is
> > >> no longer relevant (i.e. when there is no legacy canvas anymore). It can
> > >> be a "under the hood" change only in pcbnew, until the legacy canvas is
> > >> removed.
> > >>
> > >> BTW Chris, I also have some ideas for improving the visualization of very
> > >> busy (dense and high layer count) boards, I will play with them soon...
> > >
> > > Nice! I look forward to that. Definitely an area we can improve on.
> >
> > Since the schematic editor canvas doesn't support transparency, you
> > could make the colors anything you want. In the board editor, the layer
> > managers handles colors for both legacy and gal canvases so I'm not sure
> > it makes sense until the legacy canvas is deprecated.
> >
> > >
> > >>
> > >> -Jon
> > >>
> > >> On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 6:32 AM, Chris Pavlina
> > <pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx>
> <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx>>>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Let people choose. Have the default colors be wxDC-friendly.
> > Trust me,
> > >>> nobody is choosing to work with eight-layer boards in legacy.
> > >>>
> > >>> On Tue, Feb 07, 2017 at 09:01:10AM +0100, jp charras wrote:
> > >>>> Le 07/02/2017 à 06:31, Simon Wells a écrit :
> > >>>>> i thought this wasn't possible due to wxDC limitations
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Exactly, wxDC does not have a transparency feature to
> draw items.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> In this case, when you want to draw board layers with a
> > transparency
> > >>> effect, the only one other way
> > >>>> to do that is to use logic combination between colors (for
> > transparency:
> > >>> the OR operation.)
> > >>>>
> > >>>> In other to achieve a good result, you cannot use any
> color for
> > layers.
> > >>>> You have to choose a set of colors which allows this good
> result.
> > >>>> (by adjusting the 32 bits binary values of each color to
> ensure
> > a good
> > >>> result when 2 or more color
> > >>>> values are ORed)
> > >>>>
> > >>>> There are not a lot of suitable binary values.
> > >>>> In all cases the background must be black (when using OR or
> > >>> transparency).
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Note also Eeschema does not use currently transparency,
> and the
> > choice
> > >>> of colors is not critical.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> On 7 February 2017 at 17:00, Chris Pavlina
> > <pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx>
> <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx>>>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>>>> I'm working on an eight-layer board and really can't
> wait for
> > this to
> > >>>>>> hit pcbnew too. It's bloody impossible to tell layers
> apart with
> > >>> KiCad's
> > >>>>>> state-of-the-80s-art color system.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I have made a few boards with 8 and one with 16 layers.
> > >>>> There is no perfect way to see all layers.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I used Pcbnew and Altium (in a company which has a Altium
> > license) to
> > >>> design a 8 layers board (2
> > >>>> very similar boards, one with Pcbnew, the other with Altium,
> > because
> > >>> this company used Altium).
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Altium allows arbitrary colors and transparency, but a 8
> layers
> > board is
> > >>> not easy to manage.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> So do not expect allowing arbitrary colors and transparency
> > will fix
> > >>> your problem.
> > >>>> (In the best case, it slightly helps).
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Having said that, using a selected set of colors does not
> imply
> > using
> > >>> EDA_COLOR_T in Kicad code.
> > >>>> wxColor can be used instead of.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> This is only the *color choice* in Pcbnew which is
> constrained
> > in legacy
> > >>> canvas.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> EDA_COLOR_T comes from the fact the legacy graphic
> primitives where
> > >>> written for an other library,
> > >>>> not for wxWidgets.
> > >>>> (Kicad was started before wxWidgets exists)
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On Mon, Feb 06, 2017 at 10:03:11PM -0500, Jon Evans wrote:
> > >>>>>>> Hi all,
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> I started working on the idea of a color theme system
> for KiCad,
> > >>> starting
> > >>>>>>> with the schematic editor.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> This change relies on a complete removal of
> EDA_COLOR_T from the
> > >>> code, and
> > >>>>>>> replacement with a color structure that can handle
> arbitrary
> > >>> colors. I
> > >>>>>>> think this is important and the right path for the future,
> > but since
> > >>> it's a
> > >>>>>>> significant change, I wanted to get buy-in before
> going any
> > farther
> > >>> down
> > >>>>>>> this road. I can understand the reasons for using an
> enum for
> > >>>>>>> color--especially since it lets the developers
> restrict the
> > colors
> > >>> to those
> > >>>>>>> that will work well with the drawing technique of the
> legacy
> > >>> canvases.
> > >>>>>>> But, since the new canvases will have no problem
> supporting
> > arbitrary
> > >>>>>>> colors, I think it makes sense to start setting up the
> > groundwork
> > >>> for that.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> In my test code, I have replaced EDA_COLOR_T with
> wxColour,
> > since
> > >>> that is
> > >>>>>>> used internally in a few places already, and it was pretty
> > simple
> > >>> (although
> > >>>>>>> somewhat time-consuming) to replace all usages. wxColour
> > has the
> > >>> nice
> > >>>>>>> property of serializing/deserializing from hex color
> codes like
> > >>> "#80FC62"
> > >>>>>>> so that's what I use for storing in the settings for now
> > (eventually
> > >>> I
> > >>>>>>> think color settings should be in their own files so that
> > they can be
> > >>>>>>> traded by users). Plus, there is a canned
> wxColourPicker widget
> > >>> that I can
> > >>>>>>> use in place of the custom color picker buttons that are
> > used in the
> > >>>>>>> settings today.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> You can see some screenshots of the (work-in-progress)
> settings
> > >>> dialog
> > >>>>>>> changes, and an example of a custom color theme in the
> schematic
> > >>> editor,
> > >>>>>>> here:
> > >>>>>>> http://imgur.com/a/MxMmb
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> So, any feedback from the core team? Any reason why I
> > shouldn't move
> > >>>>>>> forward with preparing a patch to move from EDA_COLOR_T to
> > wxColour
> > >>> across
> > >>>>>>> the board?
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Best,
> > >>>>>>> Jon
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________
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> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --
> > >>>> Jean-Pierre CHARRAS
> > >>>>
> > >>>> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
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> > >>>
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>
References
-
RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Jon Evans, 2017-02-07
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Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Chris Pavlina, 2017-02-07
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Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Simon Wells, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: jp charras, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Chris Pavlina, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Jon Evans, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Chris Pavlina, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Wayne Stambaugh, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Jon Evans, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Wayne Stambaugh, 2017-02-07
-
Re: RFC: Arbitrary color support
From: Jon Evans, 2017-02-07
