kicad-developers team mailing list archive

[Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>]

Here is the Altium library documentation:

http://www.altium.com/documentation/17.0/display/ADES/((More+about+Components+and+Libraries))_AD

Interestingly the terms component, part, symbol, model, and footprint
are all mentioned.

It appears that the folks at Altium have answered the is it a symbol or
component question:

http://www.altium.com/documentation/17.0/display/ADES/((Understanding+Models,+Components+and+Libraries))_AD#!UnderstandingModelsComponentsandLibraries-IsitaSymboloraComponent

I was looking at the top level documentation where I saw the term
component.  Maybe symbol would be an acceptable term.  In our case it
certainly would be more accurate.  The only real difference is in the
level of detail added to the the schematic symbol that determines the
symbol/component difference and it's pretty grey definition at best.  I
retract my original statement and go with my preference of symbol.

On 3/23/2017 9:05 AM, Chris Pavlina wrote:
> Many of them actually don't have that notion. Surprisingly enough,
> Altium of all things has a system that is remarkably similar to our own,
> just with a different library management discipline applied in their
> standard library.
> 
> On Fri, Mar 24, 2017 at 01:50:08AM +1300, Simon Wells wrote:
>> Do most of the other EDA packages not refer to a component as
>> something that combines a symbol AND a footprint though?
>>
>> On 24 March 2017 at 01:34, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> I'm going to weigh in on this because this has been on my radar with the
>>> symbol library table work I've been doing.  I do agree that we need to
>>> pick one term and use it consistently.  My preference is the term symbol
>>> because in my mind this is a component[1] and this is symbolic
>>> representation[2] of a component ergo symbol.  However, I spent some
>>> time this week checking out the documentation for all of the major and
>>> quite a few minor EDA applications and they *all* use the term component
>>> when talking about libraries.  This makes me think that for the sake of
>>> uniformity with other EDA applications, we should use the term
>>> component.  While I'm not a proponent of doing something just because
>>> that's what everyone else is doing, in this case using the term
>>> component may make users coming from other EDA apps a bit more
>>> comfortable.  Personally, I'm comfortable with either term but maybe we
>>> should not stray to far from the norm here.
>>>
>>> [1]:
>>> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/stackpole-electronics-inc/CF14JT10K0/CF14JT10K0TR-ND/1741265
>>> [2]: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Resistor_symbol_America.svg
>>>
>>> On 3/23/2017 7:52 AM, Thor-Arne Hovland wrote:
>>>> Symbol has been used as long as I can remember.
>>>>
>>>> The proper names should probably be defined to avoid confusion.
>>>>
>>>> In my book:
>>>> A "symbol" is a generic repesentation for drawing a schematic,
>>>> and that is whats used in eeschema right now.
>>>>
>>>> A "footprint" is the pads and silkscreen ++ used in pcbnew.
>>>>
>>>> A "housing" is the physical package i.e. the 3D model.
>>>>
>>>> The current way of doing things is a bit confusing and causes
>>>> many "symbols" to be reused in the library.
>>>> This is not effective when someting is to be changed.
>>>>
>>>> It could be a good idea to introduce a "part" that stores all the needed
>>>> information like symbol, footprint, pin connections between symbol and
>>>> footprint,
>>>> 3D modell, documentation.
>>>>
>>>> This might be more intuitive for new user who I see repeatedly trying to
>>>> match a symbol
>>>> with pins "G-S-D" to a footprint with pins "1-2-3".
>>>>
>>>> Just my 2 cent....
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Pavlina
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2017 3:30 AM
>>>> To: Simon Wells
>>>> Cc: KiCad Developers
>>>> Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] UI improvements
>>>>
>>>> Are we calling them "symbols" now? Internally they are called with
>>>> "components" or "parts" depending on whether they are on a schematic...
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 03:25:03PM +1300, Simon Wells wrote:
>>>>> just a slight segue.... is it not better to refer to symbols rather
>>>>> than components? as with the footprints being seperated from the
>>>>> symbols i don't see the justification for calling it a component (will
>>>>> also require renaming other stuff)
>>>>>
>>>>> On 23 March 2017 at 12:12, Chris Pavlina <pavlina.chris@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 11:53:40PM +0100, Clemens Koller wrote:
>>>>>>> Hello, Fabrizio!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The horizontal + vertical justify radio buttons could possibly be
>>>>>>> improved by showing the alignment visually as it's done in [1] by
>>>>> using >> a 3 x 3 radio button matrix. It can also reduce the number of
>>>>> clicks to >> 1 to adjust hor + vert simultaneously.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The timestamp is not human readable. It seems strange to me to dump
>>>>> it >> as hex-number on the UI. (WTF!?)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm struggling to think of a use for this. Maybe for power users, to
>>>>>> jump quickly to the component in the raw sch file by searching for it -
>>>>>> but why not just search for the reference?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder how many people would complain if I took that out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Component/Chip Name thingy seems to be lost a bit on the lower
>>>>>>> left. Maybe some sorting of the elements based on the usage/setup
>>>>>>> procedure as well as logic dependency could do some good.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Clemens
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [1] https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/File:WG9-9.png
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2017-03-22 10:32, Fabrizio Tappero wrote:
>>>>>>>> hi guys,
>>>>>>>> I am looking at some new icons that were introduced in kicad by
>>>>> the >> > people who made the related functionalities and at the user
>>>>>>>> experience in general. If any of you guys has any feedback about
>>>>>>>> possible (aesthetic) UI improvements I would love to know.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Specifically I am looking at this menu.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Inline image 1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the section "Chip Name" is a part that I use a lot and I find a
>>>>>>>> little "mysterious". Before going further with a possible patch
>>>>> to >> > improve a little the usability of it I would like to know if
>>>>> there is >> > any of you interesting in giving an opinion. I would
>>>>> love to know >> > from the person who made it what exactly is the Chip
>>>>> Name section >> > for. I feel it is not so evident to the user.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> cheers
>>>>>>>> Fabrizio
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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