kicad-developers team mailing list archive

[Adam Wolf <adamwolf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

As a macOS package dev, I am in favor of enabling everything that
isn't experimental by default.  This means I have to be explicit about
things I am disabling.

Adam

On Wed, Dec 27, 2017 at 4:49 PM, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> All of your arguments are valid.  For me personally,  I'm fine with
> enabling everything that's ready for release since I build from source
> and it's not an issue on any of the platforms I use for development.  If
> that is the consensus, then I will enable them.  I'm just trying to be
> fair to our package devs.
>
> On 12/27/2017 05:42 PM, Nick Østergaard wrote:
>> 2017-12-27 23:04 GMT+01:00 Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx
>> <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>>:
>>
>>     Here are my thoughts on the current options that are disable be default.
>>      Nothing is experimental except USE_WX_GRAPHICS_CONTEXT which really
>>     shouldn't be used and the WX_OVERLAY which is macos specific.
>>
>>     KICAD_SCRIPTING, I'm fine with setting this to ON now that we have a
>>     sane solution for Python scripting on windows.  All other platforms
>>     should have python 2 support for the foreseeable future.
>>
>>     KICAD_SCRIPTING_MODULES, this can be enabled as well sense it goes hand
>>     in hand with KICAD_SCRIPTING.
>>
>>     KICAD_SCRIPTING_WXPYTHON, this is not as clear cut as it would seem.
>>     Sometimes the wxPython build gets out of sync with the wxWidgets builds
>>     on certain platforms which is known to cause issues.  Enabling this
>>     could cause issues for package devs.
>>
>>
>> It will also if they enable it explicitly... On multiple platforms this
>> ABI check between wx and wxpython is not marked as fatal and only
>> servers as a hint that you should poke the maintainers to rebuild
>> wxpython. For some reason they seems to remember to rebuild wx when the
>> compiler gets updated but not wxpython. But they should really do it,
>> there is no reason no to.
>>
>>
>>
>>     KICAD_SCRIPTING_ACTION_MENU AFAIK depends on KICAD_SCRIPTING_WXPYTHON so
>>     enabling this will dependent upon enabling KICAD_SCRIPTING_WXPYTHON.
>>
>>
>> And then what? The packager can still disable those options if he needs
>> to. IMHO it is better that the packager does not need to explicitly
>> enable any options to get a kicad build configuration that we advertise
>> as working features. All those features do work on all the three major
>> platforms. Linux, windows and macos.
>>
>>
>>
>>     KICAD_USE_OCE, I'm not so comfortable enabling this by default due to
>>     issues between version of OCE.  It might be best if this is left up to
>>     the package devs.
>>
>>
>> What issues are we talking about here? If we never enable it we will not
>> discover the issue as quickly as we could. We are not removing control
>> from the packager here. He can still disable the option if it causes him
>> any isses.
>>
>>
>>
>>     KICAD_USE_SPICE, I'm not comfortable enabling this due to the fact that
>>     some linux packages of ngspice do not build with --libngspice enabled
>>     which will cause build config issues.  I would to default to the package
>>     devs to enable this as necessary.
>>
>>
>> This is the issue of the packager on that system. If he is lazy he can
>> start by disabling this option untill he gets time to fix his platforms
>> ngspice package. It should be good now that a release of ngspice have
>> been made that has our required fixes. If the ngspice people did not
>> make that release I would be okay with having it off by default.
>>
>>
>>
>>     On 12/09/2017 11:46 AM, Kristoffer Ödmark wrote:
>>     > I think that this message is important, and I feel a decision on this
>>     > matter features has to be done by the project manager, basically
>>     give a
>>     > pointer to what should be used to as far extent as possible.
>>     >
>>     > Wayne, this is a package dev that wants to know this and while I
>>     do not
>>     > know who are package devs, the only package dev has expressed a
>>     need for
>>     > this decision. Please dont just ignore it.
>>     >
>>     > And yes, the coming patch submissions is dependent on what
>>     features are
>>     > deemed "standard"
>>     >
>>     >  -Kristoffer
>>     >
>>     > On 12/07/2017 08:58 PM, Simon Richter wrote:
>>     >> Hi,
>>     >>
>>     >> On 07.12.2017 19:08, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>>     >>
>>     >>> Yes, that is exactly what I'm saying.  it is possible kicad
>>     could have
>>     >>> different feature sets depending on the availability of
>>     dependencies on
>>     >>> the target platform.  The kicad project has no control over
>>     this.  If a
>>     >>> platform doesn't have dependency support for spice, they can still
>>     >>> provide a kicad package without spice support.  That's better
>>     than no
>>     >>> kicad.
>>     >>
>>     >> Right, but we still need to give some guidance on the status of
>>     >> features. As it is now, new features are introduced as default-off
>>     >> "experimental" stuff that is only to be used by a select few, then at
>>     >> some point we enable it for nightlies, mostly driven by
>>     availability of
>>     >> dependencies and a vague feeling that features should be tested,
>>     and at
>>     >> some point the feature has become something that should have been
>>     >> enabled by default a long time ago (but nobody can tell the exact
>>     date
>>     >> when).
>>     >>
>>     >> We need a bit of a process here to promote feature status, e.g.
>>     >>
>>     >> experimental    new stuff, not for general use
>>     >> optional    => add to nightlies
>>     >> standard    => enable by default
>>     >> required    => remove option
>>     >>
>>     >> I think all the new features for v5 have reached "optional"
>>     status, and
>>     >> they have been enabled in nightlies as far as possible. The next
>>     >> question is whether they are "standard" and should be part of the
>>     stable
>>     >> release, including questions by users and a commitment to file
>>     >> compatibility. Probably yes, but this is a project management
>>     decision
>>     >> that will affect requirements for patch submissions in the next
>>     release
>>     >> cycle, so it needs to be an explicit decision.
>>     >>
>>     >>     Simon
>>     >>
>>     >>
>>     >>
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