kicad-developers team mailing list archive

[Jon Evans <cdawzrd@xxxxxxxxx>]

Do we actually need the legacy canvas anymore? I know we need the code in
it for printing, but do we need the option to render the UI in legacy mode
or could we hide that in some place less prominent than the view menu? It
would be a lot less confusing if the only choice was between hardware
acceleration or not.

On Dec 31, 2017 13:07, "Jon Evans" <cdawzrd@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> How about "Modern" instead of GAL for user-facing stuff?
>
> "Legacy"
> "Modern (Accelerated)"
> "Modern (Fallback)"
>
> On Dec 31, 2017 12:38, "Nick Østergaard" <oe.nick@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> I don't think the term standard for Cairo is good. It is better to call
>> it fallback or faillsafe.
>>
>> Calling it standard gives the impression that this is what they should
>> choose, but really we want them to select OpenGL.
>>
>> Den 31. dec. 2017 18.12 <20%2017%2018%2012> skrev "Wayne Stambaugh" <
>> stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>:
>>
>>> Looks good to me.
>>>
>>> On 12/31/2017 12:04 PM, Jon Evans wrote:
>>> > How about something like this?
>>> >
>>> > Inline image 1
>>> >
>>> > (N.B. I agree with Andy, and think we could consider renaming the
>>> > options in the View menu to "Legacy", "Accelerated (OpenGL)" and
>>> > "Standard (Cairo)" or something like that)
>>> >
>>> > -Jon
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Dec 31, 2017 at 11:40 AM, Andy Peters <devel@xxxxxxxxx
>>> > <mailto:devel@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>     On Dec 31, 2017, at 6:49 AM, Simon Wells <swel024@xxxxxxxxx
>>> >>     <mailto:swel024@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>     What about having the default set to cairo, and when the
>>> >>     first/once run dialog runs it talks about openGL (this goes
>>> >>     against you already set to GAL) but it allows a default that even
>>> >>     if it crashes won’t require manually editing a configuration to
>>> >>     make it workable
>>> >
>>> >     User perspective:
>>> >
>>> >     The names for the canvases are “engineering terms,” that is,
>>> >     something named by the developers for their own internal use but
>>> >     were never renamed for the end user who might have no idea what is
>>> >     meant by “Cairo canvas” or what “GAL” stands for. I say that
>>> because
>>> >     early on I asked myself, “WTF is this ‘Cairo’ thing?”
>>> >
>>> >     I now understand (I think …) that Cairo and GAL implement the same
>>> >     features but the latter requires proper OpenGL hardware and
>>> drivers,
>>> >     and Cairo does not.
>>> >
>>> >     So perhaps better terms for these options is “Standard” and
>>> >     “Accelerated (OpenGL).” Users know what OpenGL means (I hope, it’s
>>> >     nothing new). As for why a user with access to OpenGL hardware
>>> would
>>> >     not choose to use it by default? Battery life on a laptop, I
>>> >     suppose, but in using Kicad for a few years now I can say I’ve
>>> never
>>> >     used the Cairo canvas at all.
>>> >
>>> >     -a
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>     Simon
>>> >>
>>> >>>     On 1/01/2018, at 2:48 AM, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx
>>> >>>     <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     I spite of my disdain for nagware, I'll tolerate this under the
>>> >>>     following conditions:
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     The current canvas is not already on one of the gal canvases.
>>> If the
>>> >>>     user is already using a gal canvas, a dialog to inform the user
>>> about
>>> >>>     the gal canvas is silly.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     It's a one shot dialog that never appears again.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     If the gal canvas crashes, the user isn't going to have to
>>> >>>     manually edit
>>> >>>     a configuration file to restore the legacy canvas.  This
>>> >>>     requirement may
>>> >>>     prevent us from setting the opengl canvas as the default so the
>>> >>>     solution
>>> >>>     may not be as easy as it seems.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     On 12/31/2017 07:34 AM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>> >>>>     +1 to the startup dialog idea.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>     I think we also need to set reasonable transparencies in the
>>> >>>>     layers so that it looks more like the default legacy canvas.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>     I don' think this is necessary given that the gal canvas layer
>>> colors
>>> >>>     and transparencies are completely user configurable but I'm not
>>> >>>     opposed
>>> >>>     to a default layer color/transparency configuration that looks
>>> >>>     more like
>>> >>>     the legacy canvas.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>>     On 31 Dec 2017, at 10:09, Clemens Koller <cko@xxxxxxxxx
>>> >>>>>     <mailto:cko@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>     On 2017-12-31 03:53, Jon Evans wrote:
>>> >>>>>>     I know this would be work for someone to do and maybe I'd
>>> >>>>>>     offer to do it if the project leaders approve...
>>> >>>>>>     What about a one-time pop-up when first installing a release
>>> >>>>>>     5.0 that appears if the config says the user was using legacy
>>> >>>>>>     canvas, telling them about how to switch and that they should
>>> >>>>>>     check it out?
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>     -Jon
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>     +1
>>> >>>>>     An initial start-up dialog to setup the "users default" after a
>>> >>>>>     first install or after a "reset Kicad to defaults, as I messed
>>> >>>>>     something up I don't remember" seems very helpful to me. If
>>> >>>>>     OpenGL might still crash in rare cases, warn the user in
>>> >>>>>     advance and explain, how he can safely step back from using
>>> >>>>>     OpenGL in case it doesn't work and how to file a bug report...
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>     Regards,
>>> >
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