kicad-developers team mailing list archive

[Jeff Young <jeff@xxxxxxxxx>]

To limit scope-creep I think the importance of the changes would be as follows:

1) sorting out the damn arrows
2) cleaning up the libedit and modedit icons
3) regularising eeschema, pcbnew and gerberview icons
4) regularising calculator, drawing frame, etc.

The largest usability improvements are in (1) and (2).  

But I really like the new icons in (3), so I’d love to see the line drawn between (3) and (4).

Using an import arrow over the pixellated ‘a’ icon could be considered part of (1) or part of (4).  Personally I’d rather see it as part of (1), but I won’t lose sleep over it either way.

Cheers,
Jeff.

> On 10 Jan 2018, at 14:58, Wayne Stambaugh <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
> I see scope creep happening here.  I thought the original goal was to
> make some minor tweaks to our existing icons not wholesale replacement
> of the them.  I don't like the camera either.  I'm not a big fan of the
> calculator icon.  Both of these icons looks completely out of place with
> our other icons.  Please keep the scope of these changes in check.  If
> we want to discuss an entirely new icon theme for v6, that's fine at the
> appropriate time but not for v5.
> 
> On 1/10/2018 9:42 AM, Jeff Young wrote:
>> Splendid!
>> 
>> Although I agree with Kristoffer that the new bitmap2component icon
>> isn’t much help.  Import/Export is the one area where we’ve kept the
>> arrows (which I think is fine).  Given that, the pixelated “a” with an
>> import arrow would be perfect.
>> 
>> FWIW, this is one area where I disagree with Nick.  I did user interface
>> design and software architecture for Adobe for 25 years and in my
>> professional opinion, these icons are a HUGE improvement.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Jeff
>> 
>> 
>>> On 10 Jan 2018, at 14:28, Oliver Walters
>>> <oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>    Also, would it be too much to ask for getting the arrows, the
>>>    diskette and the folder in the repo with the patch, basically if
>>>    someone wants to create future icons. They could use the same
>>>    arrows for any kind of export, import, save, inspect or view.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I have created a set of "common icons" for exactly this purpose :)
>>>  
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 1:27 AM, Kristoffer Ödmark
>>> <kristofferodmark90@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:kristofferodmark90@xxxxxxxxx> <mailto:kristofferodmark90@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:kristofferodmark90@xxxxxxxxx>>>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>    Wow, really nice! Although, the icon for the bitmap2component
>>>    basically looks like a screenshot symbol to me, or something
>>>    related to a webcam.
>>> 
>>>    The old one isnt as polished, but I think it fits better.
>>> 
>>>    Also, would it be too much to ask for getting the arrows, the
>>>    diskette and the folder in the repo with the patch, basically if
>>>    someone wants to create future icons. They could use the same
>>>    arrows for any kind of export, import, save, inspect or view.
>>> 
>>>    Basically to help get a icon theme thing going ;)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>     -Kristoffer
>>> 
>>> 
>>>    On 01/10/2018 03:13 PM, Oliver Walters wrote:
>>> 
>>>        Wayne,
>>> 
>>>        Here is the outcome of removing the save / load arrows and
>>>        replacing with
>>>        standard load / save icons.
>>> 
>>>        I have also further tweaked the main icons as per suggestions.
>>> 
>>>        Screenshots here:
>>> 
>>>        https://imgur.com/a/DzZhZ <https://imgur.com/a/DzZhZ>
>>> 
>>>        This is about as far as I want to go with this, please let me
>>>        know if there
>>>        are any outstanding issues that prevent me from submitting a
>>>        patch.
>>> 
>>>        Thanks,
>>>        Oliver
>>> 
>>>        On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 8:09 AM, Oliver Walters <
>>>        oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>        <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>            Ok, that's good to hear. I will take another look at the
>>>            Gerber icons and
>>>            otherwise see if anyone can suggest some simple clean
>>>            replacements for the
>>>            arrows. If not, I'll push a patch.
>>> 
>>>            On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 8:05 AM, Wayne Stambaugh
>>>            <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx> <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>>>
>>>            wrote:
>>> 
>>>                One good thing about bitmaps is they are low risk
>>>                (other than the
>>>                complaining that will surely ensue) so we can merge
>>>                them just about any
>>>                time.  I don't want to wait too long so our doc images
>>>                can be updated to
>>>                reflect the changes so if we cannot come up with
>>>                better alternatives to
>>>                replace the arrows, I'm OK with leaving them as is and
>>>                pushing it off
>>>                until v6.
>>> 
>>>                Cheers,
>>> 
>>>                Wayne
>>> 
>>>                On 1/9/2018 3:31 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>> 
>>>                    I think the changes are absolutely good in
>>>                    general, and I’d very much
>>>                    like to see them get merged.  Not that I have any
>>>                    control over that. ;)
>>> 
>>>                    As for the arrows, I’d still really like to see
>>>                    them go away.  The
>>>                    colour isn’t the problem, it’s the arrows
>>>                    themselves. ANY of the
>>>                    alternatives discussed (that don’t include arrows)
>>>                    would be better.
>>> 
>>>                    Cheers,
>>>                    Jeff.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>                        On 9 Jan 2018, at 20:13, Oliver Walters
>>>                        <oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>                        <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>>
>>>                        <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>                        <mailto:oliver.henry.walters@xxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>                        The coloured arrows were already in place, all
>>>                        I have done is made
>>>                        them all the same "style". In fact, previously
>>>                        concepts like "save"
>>>                        and "load" were conveyed both with a downward
>>>                        pointing arrow, and the
>>>                        arrow colour was the only point of difference.
>>> 
>>>                        I thought I had made an improvement on what
>>>                        was already existing. My
>>>                        intent was not to necessarily do a sweeping
>>>                        redesign.
>>> 
>>>                        If this is now an additional requirement I can
>>>                        make these not arrows,
>>>                        but I'd like some direction on what to do
>>>                        instead. It will be hard to
>>>                        fit a more detailed icon.
>>> 
>>>                        Other than this, what are your thoughts
>>>                        overall? Is it worth my time
>>>                        pursuing this further? Are these changes good
>>>                        in general and can you
>>>                        see them being merged?
>>> 
>>>                        On 10 Jan 2018 04:44, "Wayne Stambaugh"
>>>                        <stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>                        <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>>
>>>                        <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>                        <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:stambaughw@xxxxxxxxx>>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>                             On 1/9/2018 12:05 PM, Rene Pöschl wrote:
>>>                             > On 09/01/18 16:50, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>>>                             >> I'm with Jose on the arrows.  If we
>>>                        are going to use them,
>>>                             please don't
>>>                             >> make the all different colors.  I
>>>                        don't see how a blue left
>>>                             arrow versus
>>>                             >> a magenta right arrow conveys any
>>>                        meaning to the user.
>>>                             >>
>>>                             >
>>>                             > I like the idea of coloring them
>>>                        differently. For me this will
>>>                             give an
>>>                             > additional way to distinguish the
>>>                        buttons. (Some of them have
>>>                             only the
>>>                             > direction of the arrow as a difference.
>>>                        Which is easily
>>>                             overlooked.) I
>>>                             > hope having different colors will make
>>>                        it easier for my brain to
>>>                             > remember which button does what. (I
>>>                        can't tell you how often i
>>>                             clicked
>>>                             > load symbol instead of update symbol
>>>                        while working on the
>>>                             reorganization
>>>                             > of the official lib.)
>>> 
>>>                             What information does the different color
>>>                        arrow convey?  If you are
>>>                             using different colors for contrast, that
>>>                        is one thing but just
>>> 
>>>                making
>>> 
>>>                             them different colors for informational
>>>                        purposes doesn't make any
>>>                             sense
>>>                             to me.  If you are trying convey
>>>                        information with different color
>>>                             buttons, what is the impact on users who
>>>                        are color blind.
>>> 
>>>                             >
>>>                             > Maybe there is a better way to
>>>                        communicate differences but if
>>>                             buttons
>>>                             > look as similar as a lot of them
>>>                        currently do, adding
>>>                             differentiating
>>>                             > colors might help.
>>>                             >
>>>                             >
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