Re: [Ayatana] Updates on Login

[mac_v <drkvi-a@xxxxxxxxx>]

David Siegel wrote:
> The core of the idea is, at the face browser, there is a present icon
> when you have updates already downloaded and ready to install. They
> might even be unpacked already. Beside the present is a simple
> description like "13 updates available, requires restart. Click to
> update." The user either logs in as usual, ignoring the icon (maybe it's
> at the bottom/corner of GDM), or clicks the present. Clicking the
> present prompts for a password, and then shows an elegant progress bar,
> installing the updates. If the updates required a restart, the machine
> simply restarts, and our new 10 second boot time brings the machine back
> up before the user even notices it's restarting. We don't have to
> confirm shutdown, because nobody is logged in. Then, the user logs in to
> her newly updated desktop.
> 
> There are drawbacks to this approach, sure, but do you honestly not see
> any merit? I think it delivers a much more pleasant experience than
> asking the user at shutdown. At GDM, the user is not in a hurry, and
> they can take a moment to decide if they would like to update or not.
> Asking the user to update at shutdown feels like a rushed decision; the
> machine is shutting down, and you have a brief moment to either opt-in
> or opt-out of updates.
> 

I *do see the merits of implementing this* , but i'm not sure as to what
updates you are intending the use.[only for updates requiring reboot/
for all updates]... Since you have described the scenario for the
updates requiring restart, while Alex was saying to use it for all the
updates.

*If you want to implement it for all the updates*...
If the updates are not requiring reboot, then finishing the process asap
is better, why procrastinate?

You are viewing this only from a developers perspective!

*What is the actual Fun for the regular user during the updates* ?
Even if a lot of bling is added to the present icon+face browser+GDM ,
all the user has to do is to wait for a longer time to get his work
done! Do you really want to start your Monday morning for an update that
was known to the system on the previous Friday? I feel this would be
irritating.

So since the user has a choice to postpone, the update he will choose it
rather than loose time... how much ever little it might be.

How many users are going to say "Yay i'm updating"?
Do users even care what packages they are updating?
unless the user has a problem with a software , he is not going to be
having any enthusiasm for the updates for which he is not going to see
any personal benefits.Updates are done just to improve the system
stability and only the devs know how.

System requiring updates shows that the system is not baked
properly and the problems were discovered only in hindsight.
An update is for a problem within the system.
An ideal system would be one that doesnt require updates, which can
never be achieved.
 So drawing too much attention to the system flaws is not need, updates
need to be subtle, so that the user doesnt even notice them.

Even though i hate to admit, the major achievement present removal of
the update notification icon is, not much thought goes into updates. If
i used to delay the updates there used to be the icon constantly
reminding me that updates are required and i have a broken system...
But i still dont appreciate the update window popping-up by itself.


*If used ONLY for the Updates that require restart* then this would be
nice... Since you say that ,
the *packages are downloaded beforehand as soon as available* ,
,the *rest of the updates can be done while the user is working* .

If this is your idea , I think a lot of your idea was lost in
translation when Alex was proposing it.

The way i see it being a good way to implement this is:
When the user receives the updates notification,
user *chooses to download the packages* ,
Installation of Updates the dont require restart are done immediately,

Now before starting the installation of package+dependencies, which
requires a restart, the user is warned that  this particular package
requires a reboot.

User either chooses, "install now" or "during next boot" .

For good implementation of this, updates need to be clearly marked as
1:security
2:critical>solves a major crash/freeze issue of the package / major
improvement of package responsiveness
3:non-critical>minor tweaks to performance

So when the user is presented with the update requiring reboot, is told
that " This update solves a crash/freeze problem seen in this package /
Gives you major improvement of package responsiveness "

So the user decides , if he has a the problem he can do the update
immediately... If not delay it for the next boot.

If the user later chooses to update before the boot, he should be able
to do so from the update manager,
 where a reminder says"Install pending updates".

The same can be done for the firefox updates too...
 download the updates when the user accepts
and since it requires restart of the browser ,
 WAIT till the browser is closed and then install the updates.
So no need to restart the browser.

I would say implementing it as above makes more sense...
I would also like an implementation of this method.

cheers,
mac_v