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Re: How will price per user really work?

 

Hi Fabien
Just a quick question regarding your anwser.
If I apply the discount 50/60% to my customer because I do not care about
commision and I want to sell an OPW.
What happen after the two year? The customer have to paid 12€/per apps/per
user? Or you still make him a discount?

Thanks


2014-05-18 16:47 GMT+02:00 Fabien Pinckaers <fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>:

> Hi,
>
> I just wrote a blog to explain the new pricing:
>     https://www.odoo.com/blog/1/post/158
>
> Please read it before going further in this email.
>
>
> I'll try to answer most questions here:
>
> 1/ How to compute the price?
>
> The price is: # total of users X # of apps bundle X 12€
>
> 2/ Why don't we charge according to real usage? (e.g.: 5 users on CRM, 3
> on accounting, 7 on projects?)
>
> Because it's impossible to predict for yearly contracts! Quoting would
> become a nightmare and a lot of people would abuse from this unclear
> situation. (a customer would start with a low price but three month
> after we would have to upsell him because of the number of users on some
> apps)
>
> Lets take the following use case: a company of 10 users that uses CRM,
> accounting, projects. They have 3 sales person, 4 consultants, 1
> director, 1 secretary and 1 accountant.
>
> When you do a quote for this customer, how many users do they have per
> application?
>   - is the director using accounting and CRM?
>   - can the sales have read access to project for follow-ups to their
>     customers?
>   - can the accounting check sales orders coming from the sales?
>   - is it the secreatary that give access rights to others users?
>
> I checked in our production database. We have 7 persons working in the
> marketing department. If one do a quote of 7 users for the marketing
> application bundle, it's totally under-estimated.
>
> In reality, we have 45 users on marketing application, not 7:
>   - the Professional Service team that built the certification sample
>     exam on the website (survey)
>   - users that train others users on features
>   - managers that need statistics about events, mass mailing, ...
>   - most sales need an access to check prospects on events,
>   - system administrator need an access to allocate access rights and
>     test for others users
>
> 3/ Is it expensive?
>
> Absolutly not. It's 2x to 3x cheaper than the market average. Check this
> comparison of software vendors:
>   https://www.odoo.com/website/image/ir.attachment/537400/datas
>
> Moreover, partners get 50% to 60% discount on the public price. It means
> gold partners pay only 4.8€ / $6 per user and per application. Whatever
> the market, it's super cheap and super competitive.
>
>
> 4/ Is it an increase of the price?
>
> For some customers: no. (1-3 apps)
> For some customers: yes.
>
> The biggest increase would be around 2x more for one particular customer
> that uses a lot of applications. (6) I never saw a company running 10
> apps and if they do, it's normal that they pay 120€ per user because the
> value they get from Odoo is huge. No other product can offer this.
>
>
> 5/ localization & customization
>
> Odoo has a lot of huge advantages compared to traditional ERPs:
>   - higher scope: website, ecommerce, cubes analysis, CRM, ...
>   - better usability, faster implementation
>   - better flexibility: allows custom development and high level config
>
> Odoo also has a few disadvantages compared to traditional ERPs, the main
> one is the localization in some countries. (something we will fix for v9
> as we will massively invest in accounting l18n)
>
> Odoo has a lot of PROS and a few CONs. But the few CONs are largely
> compensated by the PROs. As the product is better, economics tell us
> that the product must be more expensive.
>
> Not only we are not more expensive, but we are at least 2x to 3x
> cheaper. And, if you take the partner price 4.8€ per user and per app,
> we are 6x cheaper than the competition!
>
> I do not know a lot of industry where a product can be 2X cheaper for a
> better quality.
>
> One should not be frustrated about the price.
>
> @marcelo
> > I recently read the posts by the Compiere founder explaining what
> > went wrong after he got VC money. Read it and it will look like it is
> > all happening again.
> Every time we do a change in the community people cry: take care of
> forks, read Jorge's blog, VCs are evil, OpenERP does not understand its
> users...
>
> Odoo is not comparable to Compiere/Tryton/Openbravo or others. The
> sustainability of a product is not related at all with fork threats,
> failure of others open source software or what ever.
>
> The sustainability of every product is directly linked to it's ability
> to create a sustainable model where partners and publishers get enough
> revenues to grow their activities on the product.
>
> This requires a lot of things like: having a great product allowing good
> service margins, a good price for the publisher, happy customers, etc.
>
> >      What kind of business puts potential clients in front of active
> > paying clients? The model is wrong wrong wrong.
>
> What's wrong is to have a pricing so cheap that it does not allow to
> sustain the development of the product, or too few customers because the
> product is not competitive. That's what killed some products.
>
> >       If Odoo was a ready-to-use software then the model would make a
> > lot of sense. But they are ignoring the importance of localization &
> > customization. If I wanted off the shelf software I wouldn't bother
> > going open source.
>
> Our customers don't choose Odoo beause it's open source. They choose
> Odoo because it's better (products and/or servives of partners)
>
> We should stop being frustrated of being open source. It's not because
> we are open source that we should be cheaper. The only thing that
> matters for a customer is to have a great product at an affordable price.
>
> Open Source is not a customer value, it's a way to develop better products.
>
>
> >             Also, this thing that partners will not get any commission
> >         on contracts with more than two years is REALLY nonsense. It
> >         essentially means that the contract will become 50% more
> >         expensive on the 3rd year because the partner will need that
> >         revenue back and of course it will be important for the client
> >         to keep bonds with the partner. It is really sad when companies
> >         pull this sort of crap on their "partners".
>
> My understanding is that partners don't sell Odoo Enterprise because of
> their commissions. They sell it because they need it for their customers
> and because this allows them to sell more services. (and this is how it
> should be)
>
> The part of the commission on Odoo Enterprise is usually lower than 4%
> of the revenue a partner take on a project. So, their motivation is not
> on the commission.
>
> I may be wrong. I am open to discuss this during the community days.
>
>
>
> Hope it helps better understanding this strategic move,
> Thanks for the feedback,
>
> --
> Fabien Pinckaers
> Odoo Founder
>
> Phone: +32.81.81.37.00
> Web: https://www.odoo.com
> Twitter: @fpopenerp
>
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