ubuntu-phone team mailing list archive

[Zisu Andrei <matzipan@xxxxxxxxx>]

Please stop answering this tread.

Zisu Andrei


On 22 June 2013 18:06, Fola Dawodu Esq. <folabiklan@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Oh. You are back.
>
> Well we are working hard on your droid emulator.
>
> Check back next week.
>
> Thank you
>
>
> Sent from Outer Space
>
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx>
> Date: 22/06/2013 16:11 (GMT+01:00)
> To: Josh Leverette <coder543@xxxxxxxxx>
> Cc: ubuntu-phone <ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>
>
> Before people looking at that quick first boot tutorial screen, tell us
> why would people choose touch when they already have android or ios. People
> simply don't change unless there's some reason. If you have marketing
> experience, you would know that. If touch doesn't care about marketing
> share, that would be another story.
> I never say it's an easy job to support Android apps. But it seems to be a
> shortcut for touch to gain the marketing share. Also I say right now the
> most important thing is to have a smooth reliable system. Without a stable
> system, it's no use to support Android apps.
> Third, I didn't say Android emulator is my idea. How can we get more
> effecient with an Android emulator?
>
> ------------------ Original ------------------
> *From: * "Josh Leverette"<coder543@xxxxxxxxx>;
> *Date: * Fri, Jun 21, 2013 10:03 PM
> *To: * "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>; **
> *Cc: * "Alfred Neumayer"<dev.beidl@xxxxxxxxx>; "ubuntu-phone"<
> ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; **
> *Subject: * Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>
> Navigation being different from Android and iOS will not be an issue -- a
> quick first boot tutorial screen can explain it easily enough. The lack of
> apps is far more threatening, but supporting Android apps simply *is not
> an option*. Even if it were a good idea, it still isn't an option. You
> don't realize how large of an undertaking it would be, and how poor the
> result would be. All of the engineering talent wasted on making a poor
> Android emulator for Ubuntu would then cause the rest of the operating
> system to be of even poorer quality since no one would have time to work on
> that if they're going to finish the emulator in time. That's a gambit
> you're not going to recover from. If you think it is so easy, that's why
> you're free to develop it, but you'll quickly find out on your own that it
> isn't a good idea.
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 8:54 AM, leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> If ways of navigation are completely different, then I would doubt how
>> touch would be successful in the market. People are familiar with android
>> and ios, how would people go choose one thing that's completely different,
>> and with just a few apps. Unless touch is as innovative as ios in 2007, and
>> the marketing people are as good as Jobs.
>> I hope the marketing people have thought about this.
>>
>> ------------------ Original ------------------
>> *From: * "Alfred Neumayer"<dev.beidl@xxxxxxxxx>;
>> *Date: * Fri, Jun 21, 2013 09:22 PM
>> *To: * "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; **
>> *Subject: * Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>
>> You are making it sound easier than it actually is.
>>
>> The effort that would be required to have a decently working
>> Android-compatibility layer is
>> not worth the hassle IMO, since it would put us in the same category as
>> Windows 8, where you have 2 completely different types of apps (Desktop &
>> "Metro" apps : Ubuntu SDK & Android apps).
>>
>> I would not want to have 2 completely different types of apps with
>> completely different ways of navigation and fundamental technical
>> differences on my smart phone.
>> What value does app compatibility bring if the user experience is crap?
>>
>> Am 2013-06-21 15:16, schrieb leon lee:
>>
>> To merge two systems together, we need to know more about the ARCH of
>> both, or we would be lost. I think you must be very familiar with the ARCH
>> of touch, why not introduce it to us. Or show us where to find the
>> infomation.
>>
>>
>>  ------------------ Original ------------------
>>  *From: * "Thomas Vo "<thomas.voss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><thomas.voss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> ;
>> *Date: * Fri, Jun 21, 2013 09:00 PM
>> *To: * "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx> <llrraa@xxxxxx>; **
>> *Cc: * "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx><ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>> **
>> *Subject: * Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 2:52 PM, leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>>  activity manager: like the name says, manage the activity, and also
>>> some memory management.
>>> When an activity starts, the activity manager would request zygote( the
>>> mother of almost everything in android ) to fork a thread, and then the
>>> activity manager manages this activity/thread.
>>> When the activity stops, the thread is not killed. So next time when the
>>> same activty is being started, the thread can be used for it at once, so to
>>> save time. But when the memory is not enough, the thread with no activity
>>> running would be killed first. This is the major part of memory management.
>>> So you can say activity manager just manages the thread, and this should
>>> be the basic module of touch.
>>> For android 2.3, the code locates in
>>> framework/base/services/java/com/android/server/am/, in case you want to
>>> look into it.
>>>
>>>
>>   Content provider: from comment of ContentProvider.java:
>>> Content providers are one of the primary building blocks of Android
>>> applications, providing content to applications. They encapsulate data and
>>> provide it to applications through the single ContentResolver interface. A
>>> content provider is only required if you need to share data between
>>> multiple applications. For example, the contacts data is used by multiple
>>> applications and must be stored in a content provider. If you don't need to
>>> share data amongst multiple applications you can use a database directly
>>> via android.database.sqlite.SQLiteDatabase.
>>> For more information, read Content Providers.
>>> When a request is made via a ContentResolver the system inspects the
>>> authority of the given URI and passes the request to the content provider
>>> registered with the authority. The content provider can interpret the rest
>>> of the URI however it wants. The UriMatcher class is helpful for parsing
>>> URIs.
>>> leon: I think Content provider is just the abstract class for data
>>> sharing between multiple applications, data like contacts.
>>>
>>>  For android 2.3, the code locates in
>>> frameworks/base/core/java/android/content/, in case you want to look into
>>> it.
>>> also:
>>> http://grepcode.com/file/repository.grepcode.com/java/ext/com.google.android/android/2.3.4_r1/android/content/ContentProvider.java
>>>
>>>
>>  Thanks for the summary, I'm aware of the purpose and the internals of
>> both ActivityManager and ContentProvider.
>>
>>  Again, the level of detail we would require to get started is much
>> higher and I do not think that the approach of picking two components at
>> random and summarizing their \brief-documentation helps.
>>
>>  Thanks,
>>
>>  Thomas
>>
>>
>>>  ------------------ Original ------------------
>>>  *From: * "Thomas Vo "<thomas.voss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>> *Date: * Fri, Jun 21, 2013 07:17 PM
>>>  *To: * "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>;
>>> *Cc: * "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>> *Subject: * Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>  On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 1:03 PM, leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>>
>>>> If we look at the ARCH of android, I think we need change the framwork,
>>>> expecially activity manager, window manager, content providers, view
>>>> system. If touch has such an ARCH chart, it would be easier to know what to
>>>> do from the ARCH aspect.
>>>>
>>>
>>>   We don't have an activity manager, content providers or a view system
>>> (the latter is a toolkit btw, so roughly the equivalent of Qt/QML &
>>> HTML5/JS). A window manager is there of course, but not in the sense that
>>> android exposes it. As much as I'm a fan of block diagrams, I'm afraid that
>>> we need to dive a lot deeper into the details of the Android SDK to really
>>> map individual components.
>>>
>>>  Again: Help with that is greatly appreciated :-)
>>>
>>>  Thanks,
>>>
>>>  Thomas
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  ------------------ Original ------------------
>>>>  *From: * "Thomas Vo "<thomas.voss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>>> *Date: * Thu, Jun 20, 2013 11:18 PM
>>>>  *To: * "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>;
>>>> *Cc: * "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>>> *Subject: * Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>>>
>>>>  On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 4:53 PM, leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> > When I say make android dvm available on touch, I mean keep the
>>>> performance
>>>> > of touch, and make dvm adapted to touch. It means that we will change
>>>> the
>>>> > framwork of android. this would be much helpful for touch's marketing.
>>>>  > Don't worry about the "good enough" issue. The competition of app
>>>> companies
>>>> > is tense. If touch's app performs better, and some of the companies
>>>> would
>>>> > make use of it, and the others would have to follow up.
>>>> > Btw, why do I keep making new thread in the mailist?
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> Let us assume Ubuntu Touch would want to support Android apps:
>>>>
>>>> Then we would not only need to pull in Dalvik (or an equivalent that
>>>> might need a lot of optimization to fly on mobile cpus) in its
>>>> functionality as an interpreter, but also walk through the complete
>>>> Android SDK & its class library and map all platform-specific
>>>> functionality down to the Ubuntu Touch platform. In essence, we would
>>>> need to re-implement huge portions of the SDK and maintain it over
>>>> time, as both the Android SDK and the Ubuntu Touch platform evolves.
>>>> While this is certainly doable from a technical perspective, I think
>>>> that two major issues need to be considered here first:
>>>>
>>>> (1.) There will certainly be areas in the Android SDK that we either
>>>> don't want or simply can't map to Ubuntu Touch.
>>>> (2.) The sheer size of the overall Android SDK.
>>>>
>>>> To address (1.) and (2.) we could start over with inspecting the
>>>> Android SDK and the class library and check for individual
>>>> namespaces/classes if there is an equivalent on Ubuntu Touch that they
>>>> map to. If so, it would be quite interesting to know how prominent the
>>>> component is for app developers in order to be able to prioritize the
>>>> porting effort.
>>>>
>>>> Any help with this preliminary evaluation would be greatly appreciated
>>>> :)
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Thomas
>>>>
>>>>   > ------------------ Original ------------------
>>>> > From: "Josh Leverette"<coder543@xxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> > Date: Thu, Jun 20, 2013 09:58 PM
>>>> > To: "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>;
>>>> > Cc: "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> > Subject: Re: [Ubuntu-phone]Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>>> >
>>>> > If you ever want the system to perform smoothly, then we must
>>>> absolutely
>>>> > never officially support running Android apps on Ubuntu.
>>>> Additionally, it
>>>> > would be a death sentence for Ubuntu touch. Adding Android app
>>>> support would
>>>> > crush any chance of Ubuntu ever having good apps. When companies see
>>>> that
>>>> > their Android app on Ubuntu is "good enough", they will never bother
>>>> to make
>>>> > an "excellent" version for Ubuntu. But when the only option is
>>>> excellence,
>>>> > mediocrity is not encouraged. Ubuntu will suffer at first because of
>>>> this
>>>> > decision, but it will be stronger in the long run as a result.
>>>> "Delayed
>>>> > gratification" is another way to describe it.
>>>> >
>>>> > I agree that making the system smooth is very important, but they are
>>>> > writing a new display server for Ubuntu touch. Until that is
>>>> finished, most
>>>> > time spent optimizing performance would be wasted. We must wait.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 8:30 AM, leon lee <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I still think the most important thing right now for touch is to
>>>> have a
>>>> >> reliable smoth system. For app, in the long term, we should make
>>>> android dvm
>>>> >> available on touch. So we can make use of all the android apps.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ------------------ Original ------------------
>>>> >> From: "Josh Leverette"<coder543@xxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> >> Date: Thu, Jun 20, 2013 09:45 AM
>>>> >> To: "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>;
>>>> >> Cc: "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [Ubuntu-phone]Qt5 and touch performance issue
>>>> >>
>>>> >> For now, features are most important. I hope that they will start
>>>> fixing
>>>> >> performance soon. The design is good. Performance should not be an
>>>> issue. If
>>>> >> it is, that would make me sad. I am confident that they will fix it.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Sincerely,
>>>> >> Josh
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Jun 19, 2013 8:07 PM, "leon lee" <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> This would be the major issur of touch. Can we discuss more details?
>>>> >>> Let's if there's something we can do.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ------------------ Original ------------------
>>>> >>> From: "Josh Leverette"<coder543@xxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> >>> Date: Thu, Jun 20, 2013 03:05 AM
>>>> >>> To: "leon lee"<llrraa@xxxxxx>;
>>>> >>> Cc: "ubuntu-phone"<ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>>>
>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [Ubuntu-phone] how do you feel about touch
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> It is based on Qt5, and Qt5 makes heavy use of GPU acceleration.
>>>> Right
>>>> >>> now there are a few performance issues, but I expect that Ubuntu
>>>> will run
>>>> >>> very smoothly once finished.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 8:54 AM, leon <llrraa@xxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> After know the ARCH of android, which is using java as the
>>>> framework, I
>>>> >>>> feel a little disappointed. That means that with the hardware,
>>>> android won't
>>>> >>>> be as smooth as IOS, which is on the native framework.
>>>> >>>> From that day, I'm looking forward to a better android. At first,
>>>> I'm
>>>> >>>> thinking about the combination of android and meego, just like
>>>> what touch
>>>> >>>> does today. Luckly, I found touch, so I don't need to move a long
>>>> way to get
>>>> >>>> my goal.
>>>> >>>> Since I don't have a working touch handset, I hope people using
>>>> touch
>>>> >>>> can share your feeling with me. Would it be faster and smoother
>>>> with touch
>>>> >>>> than android?
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> --
>>>> >>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>>> >>>> Post to : ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>>> >>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> Sincerely,
>>>> >>> Josh
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > Sincerely,
>>>> > Josh
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>>> > Post to : ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>>> > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>> Post to : ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Sincerely,
> Josh
>
> --
> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
> Post to     : ubuntu-phone@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>
>