ubuntu-translations-coordinators team mailing list archive

[Gunnar Hjalmarsson <ubuntu@xxxxxxxxx>]

To me it looks like different issues are unnecessarily mixed up here.

If I understand it correctly, the response to bug #590108 was to open a
way to use two locale names in a few specified cases. For instance:

If a user selects simplified Chinese as the language, followed by Taiwan
as the location, /etc/default/locale should contain:

  LANG="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_MESSAGES="zh_CN.UTF-8"
  LC_CTYPE="zh_CN.UTF-8"
  LC_COLLATE="zh_CN.UTF-8"

The proposal in this bug report is to change that, so that the same
choices result in these /etc/default/locale entries instead:

  LANG="zh_CN.UTF-8"
  LC_NUMERIC="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_TIME="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_MONETARY="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_PAPER="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_NAME="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_ADDRESS="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_TELEPHONE="zh_TW.UTF-8"
  LC_MEASUREMENT="zh_TW.UTF-8"

Both ways give us (almost) the same end result, and I don't think the
change is of a semantical nature. Making the change is still important,
since language-selector no longer sets LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and
LC_COLLATE. Future attempts to change the system language from language-
selector would else fail.

On 2012-03-19 21:58, Colin Watson wrote:
> If the user says that they speak English and live in Switzerland, what
> is the correct value for LC_NUMERIC?

Leaving Martin's remark aside for now (even if I agree it can be
discussed), I suppose it's either of 'de_CH.UTF-8', 'fr_CH.UTF-8' or
'it_CH.UTF-8'. I think I understand the complexity you want to call our
attention to, and I'd be happy to discuss it further. But IMO it's a
separate matter, i.e. the installer's way in general to deal with
localisation, and beyond the scope of this bug.

** Changed in: localechooser (Ubuntu)
       Status: Incomplete => New

** Changed in: ubiquity (Ubuntu)
       Status: Incomplete => New

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https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/926207

Title:
  Set formats related LC_* variables when applicable instead of
  LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE

Status in Ubuntu Translations:
  New
Status in “localechooser” package in Ubuntu:
  New
Status in “ubiquity” package in Ubuntu:
  New

Bug description:
  Up to Oneiric the LANG environment variable has in Ubuntu been
  considered to represent the regional formats. Hence, in cases where a
  user wants to use different locales for language respective formats,
  LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE has been set explicitly.
  Consequently the installer has set those three variables in
  /etc/default/locale when applicable.

  In Precise we are making a conceptual change, meaning that LANG now is
  considered to represent the display language, and the formats related
  LC_* variables are set explicitly when needed to distinguish between
  language and formats. As mentioned at bug #590108, this is the
  rationale for the switch:

  * It's how GNOME does it in g-c-c, and considering that we are moving
    towards replacing the language-selector UI with "Region and Language"
    in g-c-c, it would eliminate one of the current differences in
    approach between Ubuntu and GNOME.

  * There seems to be quite a few desktop apps/tools, or parts of apps,
    that ignore both LANGUAGE and LC_MESSAGES for the display language,
    and let LANG solely determine the display language. (My LANG usually
    contains a Swedish locale, while my display language is English, and
    I often see Swedish translations in dialogs and menus.)

  * Some distributions may prefer the simplistic approach to equal l10n
    with simply picking a locale name and assigning it to LANG. If we
    would switch to let LANG represent the language, the LANG variable
    would be used for language all over, which would reduce the risk for
    confusion with respect to locale/language settings.

  Changes reflecting this switch have recently been uploaded to accountsservice and language-selector. Previous settings in /etc/default/locale and /etc/environment of LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE are deleted via accountsservice.postinst.
  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/accountsservice/precise/view/head:/debian/accountsservice.postinst

  For fresh installs that code is skipped, so it's important that the
  corresponding changes are made to the installer:

    In cases when the user makes choices at installation meaning that the
    locale for display language differs from the locale for regional
    formats, the installer should set LC_NUMERIC, LC_TIME, LC_MONETARY,
    LC_PAPER, LC_NAME, LC_ADDRESS, LC_TELEPHONE, LC_MEASUREMENT and
    refrain from setting LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE.

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