unity-design team mailing list archive

[nick rundy <nrundy@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

This is my concern as well. Many people including myself use the appearance of the scroll bar to gain info on page length and size of page content. This helps me gauge size for print jobs as well as how much content is available for reading.

> From: xclaesse@xxxxxxxxx
> To: mitja.pagon@xxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 13:33:49 +0200
> CC: ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [Ayatana] New natty scrollbar issues
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Note that my grand father already forget to read the whole email in
> evolution because he does not see the scrollbar. With the new scrollbar
> he will for sure never read long emails!
> 
> Not only the scrollbar is small, but when that part of the window does
> not have the focus, it does not even have blue color. In grey nobody
> could ever see it.
> 
> IMHO, such scrollbar makes perfect sense in kinetic pannable areas, like
> we have in iOS, maemo/meego, android, etc... but surely not on a desktop
> with a mouse.
> 
> I agree each pixels count on notebook, but then limit that scrollbar to
> only notebook ubuntu installs? Also vertical pixels are much more
> important, so may I suggest hiding the top panel in unity?
> 
> Regards,
> Xavier Claessens.
> 
> Le lundi 11 avril 2011 à 12:39 +0200, Mitja Pagon a écrit :
> > 
> > ----- "Martín Soto" <donsoto@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: 
> > > 
> > > On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 10:20 AM, Mitja Pagon
> > <mitja.pagon@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > 
> >         > I see this scrollbars as another solution in search of a
> >         problem to solve and in the process introducing more problems
> >         than it solves.  When will people realize that this is not the
> >         right approach to do things.
> >         > 
> > 
> > > The main advantage of the new scrollbars is that their real estate
> > consumption is essentially 0. This may feel as a minor change when
> > you're sitting in front of a 25" screen, but on my tiny notebook where
> > every pixel counts, the improvement is significant. So yes, there are
> > still some issues, but calling the scrollbars "another solution in
> > search of a problem" appears quite unfair to me.
> > > 
> > > M. S.
> > >
> > 
> > Sorry, but every pixel counts is not a definition of a problem. Before
> > coming up with a solution, first you have to define what the problem
> > you are trying to solve is. This is the supposed problem as defined by
> > Christian Giordano, the man behind this scroll bar implementation:
> > 
> > "Today’s scrollbars are optimized for cursor driven UI but they became
> > easily unnecessary and bulky on touchable and small screen devices. In
> > those cases, optimization of the screen’s real-estate becomes
> > essential. Other platforms optimized for touch input like Android and
> > iOS are already using a light-weight solution visible only while
> > dragging the content."
> > 
> > I don't see any definition of any problems in there, just some
> > presumptions. I'm not saying scroll couldn't be improved, it's just
> > the approach that I believe is wrong, hence solution in search of a
> > problem.
> > 
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Mitja
> > 
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> 
> 
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