clicompanion-devs team mailing list archive

[Duane Hinnen <duanedesign@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 1:00 AM, Jonathan Marsden <jmarsden@xxxxxxxxxxx>wrote:

> On 11/17/2011 02:27 AM, bdfhjk wrote:
>
> > I think that now user will simply use Ubuntu functions - most of
> > they should work in Debian. If You know, that some command not work -
> > please report it and then we think about disabling it.
>
>
> Didn't you test each of the commands in a default-install on a  Debian
> machine or VM, as part of working towards getting clicompanion into
> Debian?  If not, I suggest your test process for the port is lacking.
>
> I gave two kinds of example already, commands using sudo, and commands
> using ufw :)
>
> Unless the user installs the sudo package and configures themselves to
> have full sudo rights, all commands in the .clicompanion file that use
> sudo will fail in a default Debian installation.  That is 13 out of 48
> commands in the current library, or more than 25% of the library.
>
> Since clicompanion is intended for beginners, is it OK to "assume" that
> such users will know how to install and configure sudo in Debian, and
> will know that they need to do this to make use of those commands?  I
> suspect not.
>
> > In the future, we will add system detecting and commands, which not
> > work, will not appear.
>
>
> I'm not sure this is sufficient, or simple.
>
> When exactly would you test for command presence?  What happens if I
> install Debian, run clicompanion, and then look at this list (it should
> have no sudo commands in it, by your reasoning).  Then, in clicompanion,
> I do
>
>  gksu apt-get install sudo
>  gksu visudo # edit the file appropriately to add my user
>
> Now, in the same instance of clicompanion, on the same OS, those
> commands starting with sudo *should* appear!  But testing every command
> for presence dynamically before/after every command could be a
> significant performance drain, for little benefit to most users.
>
> If you really want to baby your users, perhaps trying to use a command
> starting with sudo on a Debian machine without sudo installed should pop
> up a clicompanion dialog asking if you want to install sudo and add
> yourself to the /etc/sudoers file, and if you click Yes, do it for you?
>  Going further, perhaps trying to use a command starting with "sudo ufw"
> should offer to install both sudo and ufw?
>
> One easy improvement to think about: would it be worth considering
> switching all these sudo commands to use gksu instead, which defaults to
> running sudo underneath it in Ubuntu, but defaults to using su
> underneath it in Debian (and which one it uses is configurable, using a
> gconf key, if you want to change things around)...?
>
> Of course, some minimalist installations of Debian may not install gksu,
> either :)
>
> There are many variations possible for dealing with this; saying "we
> will add system detecting and commands, which not work, will not appear"
> seems as though you have already decided exactly which approach
> clicompanion will take... with no discussion with the rest of the team,
> no public evaluation of the options, no attempt to reach consensus??
>
> > Please report it as bug.
>
>
> Well, it's not exactly a bug, if we expect clicompanion users to be
> knowledgeable about the two different approaches of su and sudo, and how
> to set up and use either one on their OS of choice.  It's more of an
> enhancement request, isn't it?  Is it worth making an LP blueprint for?
>
> Jonathan
>
>
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>


This is very interesting. I did not even think of this. i chose to install
sudo during installation on my Debian box so I never thought about this.
At the moment I am inclined to think the gksu option would be the front
runner solution so far.
I think this is a fairly big issue.
I think the program should be just as useful to beginners as well as more
advanced users. So I think the app should be as smart as possible in
handling this without as Jonathan points out compromising performance.

-- 
Duane Hinnen
duanedesign@xxxxxxxxx
skype: duanehinnen