kubuntu-council team mailing list archive

[cprofitt <cprofitt@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Ben:

A few responses to yours.

On Sat, 2015-07-18 at 16:42 -0700, Benjamin Kerensa wrote:
> Charles,
> 
> I don't believe anything I said was inaccurate and yes I did use
> profanity but as its been explained to me profanity in and of itself
> is not a violation of the Code of Conduct. That said this remark was
> made on a third-party site not subject to the Ubuntu Code of Conduct
> but that values freedom of expression and does not prohibit such
> vernacular.

1. I never said there was a CoC violation, nor did I imply it.
2. Accuracy has no affect on 'tone'.
3. I was not aware that the Code of Conduct was limited in the fashion
you imply.

> I would appreciate Charles if you adverted more attention to the
> decline in participation identified as a problem here:
> 
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-community-team/2015-July/000661.html
> 
My attention is already on that issue. I am glad you are paying
attention to it as well. Being more careful in ones choice of words and
the tone of their communications when discussing issues that affect
participation would be helpful with the issue of participation as well.
A hostile environment is not a place that new people will find
attractive to participate in.

> Notably several former governance members have said on social media in
> a nutshell that they stopped participating because of the issues I
> raised.

Noted. I am not sure your wording was necessary to convey that point.
> 
> Most recently insulted on a mailing list by a community council member
> but of course the CC had no issue with that and no reply asking that
> person to be mindful of the CoC was sent:
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2015-June/010801.html

Perhaps it slipped your notice that the person is no longer on the CC. I
am also positive you are not aware of any private communications
regarding the matter so you can not, honestly, say that the CC had no
issue with that. The fact that you were insulted also does not make it
right for you to do the same.

As a side note, I mailed this to the KC list based on the expressed
desire for discussions such as these to be public. Normally, I would
have sent you a private email or touched based with you on IRC.

> This pretty much amounts to you asking the Kubuntu Counsel to ask me
> to self censor.

Choosing different words to make your point is not equivalent to self
censoring in my opinion. If you wish to be bombastic and abrasive that
is your choice. It is not the way I would chose to operate and not the
way I would advise a friend to operate. 
> 
> I'll just leave these right here:
> https://twitter.com/OpenSourceOrg/status/622491796203900928?s=09
> 
> https://twitter.com/zacchiro/status/622506047568097280?s=09
> 
> https://twitter.com/zacchiro/status/622504936719282176?s=09
> 
> Seriously take a clue the CC is supposed to lead and advocate for
> community and has not done that on this issue. You censored us and
> demotivated hundreds of contributors and other orgs and projects have
> realized this.

In my opinion no one was censored. People were asked to be respectful
and polite.

> Are you going to strip my status next and make me more of an outcast
> than I already feel like for standing up for what is right? For things
> you should be standing up for?

Huh? I do not have such powers, nor was it suggested.

> Its sad when I can honestly say no other open source project or
> project governance would engage in such a campaign of censorship.

I would disagree that there has been any campaign of censorship. There
was an effort to ask people to be more respectful and polite.

> Disclaimer: These remarks are my own and do not reflect the Kubuntu
> Council or Community or any project or organization I associate with.
> 
Now, the question remains. Do you want to work together or simply thrash
about making bombastic and abrasive statements.

I ask that you stop seeing this as an adversarial relationship and try
to help move the relationship forward in a collaborative manner.
> 
Charles