openshot.developers team mailing list archive

["eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx" <eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx>]

Jonathan,
I am wondering me if this framework will use the Frei0r-plugins ? Is it the
case ?
I assume that you have not yet open a new project on Launchpad for him.

2011/4/12 eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx <eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx>

> Jonathan,
>
> Cimg C++ is done by the same author Davide Tschumperlé who have began to
> work on this library and after on G'mic who use this one. G'mic comes from
> more than 500 commands and it was not the priority of the development (but
> more the language and the library). The best way is having a conversion with
> this author. Perhaps, if you want we can speak on Gmail or on IRC. I can
> join David and it will explain better his software. And I understand well
> that a lot of work have been done on this but I am sure that we will miss
> something and I prefer re-speak about this (vow after I will stop ^^) than
> never.
>
> I have forgotten to say about on Python 3.2 that this version will be soon
> the standard on all the Linux distribution. And she will be include on the
> major of them. Anyway his installation is really easy and can live with the
> normal version (2.7).
>
>  | I am definitely open to suggestions on how to name this library, but I
> don't think I like a word I can't pronounce:
> Mjöllnir. =)  Ideally, we would include the term "OpenShot" in the name.  I
> have not put much though behind the name yet.
>
> Yeah , i convince.   OpenValhalla(Shot) (contraction of Openshot and
> Valhalla) or  Open(Shot)Graal (contraction of Openshot and Graal)
> What do you think about ?
>
>  | My main focus over the next few weeks will be on this new library, with
> a goal of getting a demo put together which showcases how it works.
>
> Okay so I will look for the DVD Iso Creation like I have already work
> on.............
> Perhaps the 1.3.1 before ? And after work on the next version ? It will
> take a lot of time and we have not give into of the habit of having a
> version quickly.
>
> Cheers.
>
>
> 2011/4/12 Jonathan Thomas <jonathan.oomph@xxxxxxxxx>
>
>> Olivier,
>> The G'mic project is based on the Cimg C++ image library, which I also
>> evaluated.  Cimg was very limited on image formats, and required the
>> installation of ImageMagick to handle any unknown formats.  It seemed that
>> ImageMagick already duplicates most of the Cimg functionality, so I thought
>> Cimg was just an unnecessary library.  I don't think G'mic is a library, but
>> rather an automation framework that uses the Cimg library.  Also, Cimg seems
>> to have a rather small group of developers compared to ImageMagick.  What
>> features does Cimg have that ImageMagick does not?  I guess that is the
>> question to ask.
>>
>> I am definitely open to suggestions on how to name this library, but I
>> don't think I like a word I can't pronounce: Mjöllnir. =)  Ideally, we
>> would include the term "OpenShot" in the name.  I have not put much though
>> behind the name yet.
>>
>> In the short term, we need to release 1.3.1, but there is still 1 bug
>> outstanding I haven't had time to look at yet.  Yeah, any of the suggestions
>> from our GSOC application can be worked on, and the timeline really needs to
>> have some work put into it.  For example, I really want to address the
>> ability to zoom in and out faster, support larger timelines (i.e. dynamic
>> scrolling and drawing of the timeline), selection of multiple clips, etc...
>>
>> My main focus over the next few weeks will be on this new library, with a
>> goal of getting a demo put together which showcases how it works.
>>
>> Thanks!
>> -Jonathan
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 12:02 PM, eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx <eolinwen@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Jonathan,
>>>
>>> Like Andy was saying, just one word : Whaooo.
>>>
>>> Effectively, with the 1.3.0 version (and it has began with the previous)
>>> , we can see the limit of the MLT framework who need some works of their
>>> part. But we are not the master of it.
>>>
>>> Analysis of the existing Frameworks is really good and me too I was
>>> having a lot of hope in the AML Framework. For nothing with the reason that
>>> you have given us.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> * | My focus has been to develop a framework that has the following
>>> features:*
>>>
>>>    - *C++ code base.  Object-oriented.  Simple API and design.  Good use
>>>    of Exceptions and error handling.  Prevent crashing at all costs.*
>>>    - *Multi-processor aware (take advantage of all available processing
>>>    cores)*
>>>    - *Powerful bezeir curve-based keyframe system (every setting and
>>>    parameter should support keyframes)*
>>>    - *A node-based audio system, including JACK support, and LADSPA
>>>    filters.  Also, strong audio analysis, including waveforms, spectral
>>>    analysis, time stretching / shrinking, and 3D audio (i.e. dolby / surround
>>>    sound).  I have spent much of my time improving my understand of audio
>>>    processing. =)*
>>>    - *FFmpeg <http://www.ffmpeg.org/>*
>>>    * *
>>>    *-based, for decoding and encoding*
>>>    - *Use a powerful image processing module: ImageMagick++<http://www.imagemagick.org/Magick++/>
>>>    *
>>>    * *
>>>    - *Use a powerful audio processing module: CLAM Audio<http://clam-project.org/>
>>>    *
>>>    * *
>>>    - *Python interface designed specifically for OpenShot (to minimize
>>>    the impact to OpenShot changing multimedia back-ends)*
>>>    - *All meta data available via the API (list of profiles, list of
>>>    effects, parameters of effects, etc...)*
>>>
>>> I know that you are confident but create a Video Framework is really a
>>> hard task and huge work. On the paper, it is very very interesting and all
>>> benefits for us and the user.
>>> I want to do a proposition about the Image processing module. I have a
>>> remark about him.
>>>  For my opinion , we should use his competitor : G'mic<http://gmic.sourceforge.net/>(instead of ImageMagick). LIke you can see, G'mic is not only a script
>>> language (like Imagemagic)  but it is too a framework powerful stable and an
>>> interpreter. He is packaged for all the distributions and in intensive
>>> development and go always on forward.. You could have a look here<http://gmic.sourceforge.net/reference.shtml>,
>>> (and here <https://bugs.launchpad.net/openshot/+bug/725303> too) in the
>>> Gimp plugin and in EKD (development version only but you have some
>>> possibility here<http://ekdm.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/nouveaux-filtres-image-pour-ekd-implementation-finalisee-le-02032011/>
>>> , here<http://ekdm.wordpress.com/2010/07/21/quand-ekd-rencontre-gmic-premiere-partie/>
>>> , here<http://ekdm.wordpress.com/2010/07/23/quand-ekd-rencontre-g%E2%80%99mic-deuxieme-partie/>,
>>> and here<http://ekdm.wordpress.com/2010/07/27/quand-ekd-rencontre-g%e2%80%99mic-troisieme-partie/>).
>>>
>>> I insist but please see your position.  I believe like hard iron that if
>>> we don't use it we miss something and pass beside something essential for
>>> the image.  the both could give (and the other modules of course) a awesone
>>> powerful, impressive software.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thinking at something else, we could use Python 3.2 instead of 2.7. It is
>>> the occasion
>>>
>>> Tell me when you will post a blog entry, I am going to prepare something
>>> that I will adapt after.
>>>
>>> A version like this, should be at least a version ..........3.0 (no I am
>>> laughing the 2.0 will be perfect. ^ ^ )
>>>
>>> A name for this framework will be very nicely. Have you think at
>>> something ? I will see well *Mjöllnir *the name of the Thor 's hammer.
>>> It will be perfect for this framework who is your armed arm for Openshot.
>>> Now, with this, we will playing in the taller playground.
>>>
>>> With all this features (audio have a big part in it), I have some
>>> contacts with a strong and mainly audio French community (and    to be more
>>> precise with the Tango Studio) <http://tangostudio.tuxfamily.org/>. I
>>> will have (certainly) a person who will create the package for the framework
>>> and certainly all the French audio Users (perfect for the test :=) ). I hope
>>> to see it in the RMLL (the 5 & 6 July if I can go ) and If it is not
>>> possible for the Ubuntu Party of November, I will go to Paris for that.
>>> Since the time that I want to go to t this event).
>>>
>>>
>>> * |
>>> *
>>> *That is big news. If you're confident you can do it, then go for it. It
>>> will be a huge advantage for Openshot to have it's own library, and as you
>>> say will eliminate a lot of library problems if the library is under our
>>> control (although format support will still be ffmpeg dependent?).*
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *A quick word on the audio front - LV2 is rapidly becoming the new
>>> standard for audio plugins, so we should aim to support that as well as
>>> LADSPA :-)*
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *Look forward to seeing the results!*
>>>
>>> Totally agree with Andy. Same if I am a bit afraid with the framework,
>>> let's go onward. Go go go .
>>>
>>> What do you plan a short term ? Did we began to developp something or not
>>> ? What are the plan for the ...........suit. Can I implement DVD iso
>>> Creation (dvd creator and a Export module iso (like the draft of  the GSoc)
>>> ?
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers.
>>>
>>> 2011/4/12 Jonathan Thomas <jonathan.oomph@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>
>>>> Andy,
>>>> Yes, I am confident I can do it, as I've already put down quite a bit of
>>>> code and I am really feeling good about it all.  The formats and codecs will
>>>> still be driven by FFmpeg and which codecs it was installed with.  LV2 is
>>>> also supported by the CLAM audio library, so that should not be an issue.  I
>>>> am just trying to push myself to get everything wrapped up quickly so I can
>>>> get it onto LaunchPad.  =)
>>>>
>>>> Also, once we get a somewhat working and complete version of the
>>>> framework, we can branch OpenShot and starting integrating everything in
>>>> it's own branch.  Finally, once the new branch is stable and all of us
>>>> developers are happy with OpenShot, we'll merge this branch back into the
>>>> main trunk.  Possibly this could be version 2.0 of OpenShot?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>> -Jonathan
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Andy Finch <we.rocked.in79@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> One word -  Whoa!
>>>>>
>>>>> That is big news. If you're confident you can do it, then go for it. It
>>>>> will be a huge advantage for Openshot to have it's own library, and as you
>>>>> say will eliminate a lot of library problems if the library is under our
>>>>> control (although format support will still be ffmpeg dependent?).
>>>>>
>>>>> A quick word on the audio front - LV2 is rapidly becoming the new
>>>>> standard for audio plugins, so we should aim to support that as well as
>>>>> LADSPA :-)
>>>>>
>>>>> Look forward to seeing the results!
>>>>>
>>>>> Andy.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11 April 2011 21:12, Jonathan Thomas <jonathan.oomph@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi everyone!  I have some *Big OpenShot News *today to announce to
>>>>>> everyone!  I know I've been real quiet the past 4 to 6 weeks, but all of
>>>>>> that is about to change.  I have been developing a new video editing
>>>>>> library, written in C++, based on FFmpeg, and patterned after the animation
>>>>>> framework used by Blender.  I have been thinking about this for a long time,
>>>>>> and have a very clear vision for what I am creating.  Let me breakdown my
>>>>>> decision, and give some supporting facts:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *MLT* has been a* great framework*, but almost all of the bugs and
>>>>>> complaints we get are related to MLT: crashes, choppy HD video playback,
>>>>>> choppy audio, poor JACK support, poor multi-core performance, scaling
>>>>>> issues, poor key-frame support, limited de-interlacing options, and issues
>>>>>> with frame accuracy when seeking.  As we move forward with OpenShot, it is
>>>>>> important we solve and improve these highly complex issues.  The way I see
>>>>>> it, we have 3 options when it comes to improving the video framework
>>>>>> that OpenShot uses.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    - *Option 1:* Enhance the MLT framework
>>>>>>       - With an aging C code base, limited key-frame support, buggy
>>>>>>       multi-threading, the work required and the risk is very high to enhance some
>>>>>>       of the core features in MLT.  C has no error handling, no support for
>>>>>>       object-oriented code, and other issues that make development more difficult.
>>>>>>    - *Option 2:* Switch to the AML framework<https://launchpad.net/ardome-ml> (developed
>>>>>>    by Charlie Yates, one of the original developers of MLT)
>>>>>>       - Although I was initially excited about this option, it has
>>>>>>       become difficult to contact Charlie, and the framework has not been modified
>>>>>>       since mid-2010.  However, this project inherits much of it's code from
>>>>>>       another (even older project), and thus it is quite complex.
>>>>>>    - *Option 3:* Create a new framework, with complete control over
>>>>>>    stability, design, and features
>>>>>>       - This is a high risk option, but has the greatest advantage,
>>>>>>       as the code base can be designed around OpenShot, and only contain the
>>>>>>       features we need
>>>>>>
>>>>>> After much research and consideration, I have chosen option 3.  This
>>>>>> required creating many simple proof-of-concept C++ applications and many
>>>>>> conversations with the upstream projects that would be involved in such
>>>>>> an endeavorer.  At this point, I have proven all the concepts that needed
>>>>>> proving, and I am feeling very confident about the design and implementation
>>>>>> at this point.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> *My focus* has been to develop a framework that has the following
>>>>>> features:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    - C++ code base.  Object-oriented.  Simple API and design.  Good
>>>>>>    use of Exceptions and error handling.  Prevent crashing at all costs.
>>>>>>    - Multi-processor aware (take advantage of all available
>>>>>>    processing cores)
>>>>>>    - Powerful bezeir curve-based keyframe system (every setting and
>>>>>>    parameter should support keyframes)
>>>>>>    - A node-based audio system, including JACK support, and LADSPA
>>>>>>    filters.  Also, strong audio analysis, including waveforms, spectral
>>>>>>    analysis, time stretching / shrinking, and 3D audio (i.e. dolby / surround
>>>>>>    sound).  I have spent much of my time improving my understand of audio
>>>>>>    processing. =)
>>>>>>    - FFmpeg <http://www.ffmpeg.org/>-based, for decoding and encoding
>>>>>>    - Use a powerful image processing module: ImageMagick++<http://www.imagemagick.org/Magick++/>
>>>>>>    - Use a powerful audio processing module: CLAM Audio<http://clam-project.org/>
>>>>>>    - Python interface designed specifically for OpenShot (to minimize
>>>>>>    the impact to OpenShot changing multimedia back-ends)
>>>>>>    - All meta data available via the API (list of profiles, list of
>>>>>>    effects, parameters of effects, etc...)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What's next?  Soon (i.e. in the next 2 weeks hopefully) I will wrap up
>>>>>> my initial framework code and start setting up the project in LaunchPad.
>>>>>>  Realistically, there is about 6 weeks of work left for me to achieve all
>>>>>> the features I want.  The development of this framework will be fast and
>>>>>> will be very focused, so I don't expect this to take very long to complete.
>>>>>>  Of course, once LaunchPad has the source code, we will need to "hopefully"
>>>>>> recruit some other C++ programmers to help us out, especially with the build
>>>>>> process and packaging.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *The big picture:*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    - *Great Stability*
>>>>>>    - *Better Performance*
>>>>>>    - *A huge increase in the number of image and audio effects
>>>>>>    (including JACK support)*
>>>>>>    - *Animation key-frame system that rivals Hollywood animation
>>>>>>    packages*
>>>>>>    - *Much simpler framework (i.e. less code to maintain)*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hopefully I have convinced everyone that this is a good decision, and
>>>>>> not some knee jerk decision. =)  I am very excited about this, and I have no
>>>>>> doubt we can achieve these results very quickly.  Soon I will announce this
>>>>>> on my blog, but I wanted to get feedback from our OpenShot Developers team
>>>>>> first.  So, please let me know what you think.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>> -Jonathan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openshot.developers
>>>>>> Post to     : openshot.developers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openshot.developers
>>>>>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openshot.developers
>>>> Post to     : openshot.developers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openshot.developers
>>>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Olivier
>>> Cenwen un elfe sur la banquise/ an elve on the ice
>>> Mon blog perso  sur le multimédia, Ubuntu, Linux et OpenShot :
>>> http://linuxevolution.wordpress.com/
>>> Le forum d'Openshot où vous me trouverez : http://openshotusers.com/
>>> http://openshotusers.com/forum/index.php
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Olivier
> Cenwen un elfe sur la banquise/ an elve on the ice
> Mon blog perso  sur le multimédia, Ubuntu, Linux et OpenShot :
> http://linuxevolution.wordpress.com/
> Le forum d'Openshot où vous me trouverez : http://openshotusers.com/
> http://openshotusers.com/forum/index.php
>



-- 
Olivier
Cenwen un elfe sur la banquise/ an elve on the ice
Mon blog perso  sur le multimédia, Ubuntu, Linux et OpenShot :
http://linuxevolution.wordpress.com/
Le forum d'Openshot où vous me trouverez : http://openshotusers.com/
http://openshotusers.com/forum/index.php