osdf-devteam team mailing list archive

[Andrew Ettinger <sillydeveloper@xxxxxxxxx>]

All very good points Sam. 

I agree that there are a lot of options out there, which is why I'm trying to drive organizational discussion onto the boards so that the teams can get organized and each team can figure it out on their own (much like we have with LaunchPad and this list).

If you would like to discuss how a particular team is organized, I invite you to comment in the appropriate sub forum so we can keep this list on technical topics. If you can convince those teams to use LaunchPad, then we will certainly make room for them and help them move there =)

For now, let's keep this on technical issues and put the organizational issues into the forum so we can start talking about how these new teams are going to operate. 

~ Andrew


On Dec 21, 2010, at 9:55 AM, Sam Hart wrote:

> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 8:32 AM, zeto28 <amf5bp@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 02:16:56PM -0800, Andrew Ettinger wrote:
>>> I was thinking we should install / use a listserver for the other
>>> teams, so they don't have to go through LaunchPad...
>> 
>> Finally.  However, I already see a big problem emerging: we are getting
>> too many channels with no clear definition of each one's purpose.
>> Having to follow both the forum and the lists will become a pain very
>> quickly, and we should resolve this as early as possible.
> 
> I actually totally agree with this- I even thought of it after I
> submitted my suggested on Google Groups (but was too busy to
> follow-up).
> 
> I mean, let's re-cap what we have right now (and I may not even have
> everything covered, so please someone correct me if I'm missing
> something):
> 
> * Launchpad, which includes:
> - This mailing list
> - Some issue tracking
> - Source-code management
> - A wiki
> - Other items? (Did someone mention a forum?)
> * The Reddit Subgroup
> * A couple of websites including
> - http://www.theosdf.org/ is the new hotness
> - Didn't we have something else at one point as well?
> 
> The way *I* see it, we're pretty close to being saturated with methods
> of communication.
> 
> Launchpad and its features are probably the best for the
> developer-side of things- dealing with code, managing technical
> details, etc. I saw Stacy say that she didn't find Launchpad useful
> for project management with designers, but (and it's not my intention
> to be rude) I'd suggest that's probably not a flaw in Launchpad-
> Launchpad is used in over 6,000 projects[1] including and most notably
> Ubuntu http://www.ubuntu.com/ . Chances are if we can't find what we
> need for project management in Launchpad, we're probably just using it
> wrong.
> 
>> The only things that speak for a web forum are that less tech-savvy
>> people can use it more easily and that moderators can move, split and
>> merge threads.  However, it is easy to DDOS, provides only very basic
>> search functions (no regexps, rate-limited), is insecure (SMF stores
>> passwords in the clear AND mails them around!), and lacks tree threads
>> and message-level read management.  Mailing lists OTOH are fully
>> decentralized, searchable on the client-side (reducing server load),
>> support tree threads, offer far better read management (i.e. one has to
>> only hit a key to read the next unread message), and official posts can
>> be cryptographically signed so everyone knows they're genuine.  There
>> will be some reasons that the Linux kernel developers don't use a forum
>> as the primary means of communication.  I for one have developed kind of
>> an aversion to web forums.
> 
> I agree there probably *should* be some sort of forum/mailing-list
> barrier between those averse to forums and those averse to mailing
> lists. I am certainly in the "I hate forums" camp (because I'm
> definitely from the hardcore, low-level Free-Software development
> camp). But I will admit that for some general person who *just* wants
> to communicate with the rest of the team (and not really contribute in
> any other way other than make a post) a forum is the way to go.
> 
> The real question is, what do we get from additional forum software
> that we don't already get from the rpac subreddit? E.g., do we
> *really* need another bit of technology thrown into an already crowded
> pool?
> 
>> If MajorDomo is too arcane, GNU Mailman would be the next best
>> alternative, I think.  There also exists a software called "Syncom"
>> whose purpose it is to sync Mailman mailing lists and a phpBB forum
>> using a news server.
> <snip>
>> Google Groups would probably be technically an option, but only for
>> lists where the public can't post
>> (<http://ejohn.org/blog/google-groups-is-dead>).  Using Google
>> infrastructure would make me feel uncomfortable, though.  We should only
>> consider that as a last resort option, I think.
> 
> See, the extra complication you detailed above was exactly why I
> originally suggested Google Groups as it would come pre-built with
> those integrated features (and we all tend to be busy- I'd hate us to
> commit to some complicated integration that none of us have the time
> to complete).
> 
> But I'll admit for the same reasons I was uncomfortable automatically
> recommending HSBC here
> http://www.reddit.com/r/rpac/comments/elqvi/what_bank_should_we_use/c191ztu
> , I'm also hesitant recommending Google.
> 
> [1] https://bugs.launchpad.net/
> 
>                                       ---Sam
> 
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