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Re: new proposal for notifications / indicators

 

i like it, i would actually keep the volume always visible since i mouse over it frequently, also in windows, kde, etc. is also kept visible (but is configurable in kde).

i do have this area pretty cluttered: glipper, system monitor applet, keyboard language switcher and all the others.

so this would help but a person should configure to keep the applets they want visible all the time or on demand, etc..

> Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 11:05:38 +0100
> From: david.reichling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To: mpt@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> CC: ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators
> 
> Holy shit gmail removed somehow when i make a new line.
> Resending my mail:
> Hi,
> i didn't explained my idea good enough and you and probably others
> have understand me wrong.
> so i try to explain with different words.
> the basic idea is that when you turn the computer on it shows the
> minimum of indicators thats
> possible.
> http://unity.exemo.net/panel_beginning.png
> you can expand them by clicking on the arrow:
> http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png
> 
> when an "event" happens 4 different things can happen:
> a: show only a notification
> b: show a notification and show an indicator
>    (if the indicator is already visible add an entry to the menu)
> c: show a notification and hide an indicator
> d: remove an entry from an indicator menu
>    (if its the last entry the indicator will be hidden)
> 
> The nofifications are like now and will fade in and after a few sec. fade out.
> The indicators will be show at an event and remain visible until later
> when another event hides it again
> 
> Examples:
> Event: Files will be uploaded to ubuntu one
>   What happens:
>     a:    -show notification: x files will be uploaded ...
> 
> Event: You get a new mail
>   What happens:
>     b:   - show notification: You got a new mail ...
>           - show message indicator
>           - http://unity.exemo.net/new_mail.png
> 
> Event: You remove the cable from your laptop
>   What happens ->
>     b:    - show notification: You have x hours left ...
>            - show batteryindicator
>            - http://unity.exemo.net/mail_and_battery.png
> 
> Event: You focus the chat window
>   What happens:
>     d    - remove the previously added "chat-notification-entry" from
> the message menu
> 
> Event: You connect the cable to your laptop
>   What happens -> c:
>     - show notification: Battery will be full in ...
>     - hide battery indicator
>     - http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png
> 
> > Why? What problem would it be solving?
> That's a good question (as always ;-))There has been already a lot of
> work done in the top right corner and i don't see any real problems
> with what we currently have. The only thing is that i have currently 8
> indicators that are always visible. Other users might have more or
> less. I just think that it would look better when you have a maximised
> application and you have less indicators visible.
> (the minimum possible)
> I think for the same reason that the window buttons are not
> visible when not needet.
> 
> > If the messaging menu was hidden by default, what use would it be?
> I didn't mean to use the messaging menu like we have it today.
> More something like a list of the latest notifications that you got
> Looking something like this: http://ubuntuone.com/3pQaNx9TdpPXEZHMIjPgdP
> except not the tabs at the bottom
> 
> > How do you classify devices under "notification indicators"? What
> > would this notify you of?
> (using the word notifications was not really a good idea from me.)
> We could show for example an entry for every device where it makes
> sense. Every entry could contain a menu with actions
> For example
> - UsbStick
>    - Documents (17) // open gnome-documents
>    - Videos (3) // open gnome videos
>    - see all files // open nautilus
> - Video DVD
>    - Watch Movie // open totem
>    - Import or Rip Movie // open ...
> etc
> This could remove the need to open a window in situations like this:
> 
> "If a new printer is plugged in and recognized automatically while
> neither a Print dialog nor System Settings (any panel) is open, System
> Settings should open to the Printers panel, the list of printers
> should scroll to show the new printer, and it should be selected in
> the list. (This is analogous to a USB storage device window opening
> when it is connected.)"
> 
> But i have to say that i have not really thought a lot about how the
> specific indicators could look like. I just wanted to give a few
> examples.
> 
> > People didn't see the updates notification area item even when it was
> > shown by default. What use would it be if it was hidden? :-)
> The reason why some people don't see it is in my opinion because we
> have indicators where some people don't care about.
> Lets say we have a user who uses his computer only to look his mails
> (in gmail) and
> to browse the internet. His first time where he uses ubuntu he look
> around and finds out how to connect to the internet, ... (or a friend
> shows him)
> But after that the internet connect automatically etc and he
> just look at the top-right to look at the clock and maybe adjust the
> volume when he is in youtube.
> He simply doesn't care about what else is there.
> 
> When i look how it works for example in android:
> At the top left you have the name of your carrier and nothing else
> When you got 1 or more
> notifications the carrier will be replaced with 1 or more icons.
> You now have icons where before where only text. You see that immediatly
> and choose based on the icons if you want to check the
> notification now, later or just clear it.
> If i am right about this people will notice the update-indicator.
> Because if only the things that are important for
> them are visible and they see an unknown icon they will check if its
> maybe important too? (at least i think so)
> 
> > Also, a menu item wouldn't show enough information for you to be able
> > to decide whether you want to update a particular application.
> That's right. As is said earlier i just wanted to give a few examples and
> maybe it doesn't make sense to show an update-indicator.
> 
> > Why? What would be the use of collecting progress of different tasks
> > into a menu?
> AFAIK there are basicly 2 forms of progress in applications.
> a: You have for example firefox, torrents, ... where you can still use the
> application while tasks (download) is running in the background.
> b: On the other side we have applications that you can no longer use when a
> task is running. The only reason not to hide the application is to look
> at how many % the task is or to see more details about whats happening
> while a task is running. For example update-manager, synaptic, ...
> I think for "a" it is good because you can see how far for example
> your download is without having to switch to firefox.
> For "b" developers could offer a feature to hide the application and by
> clicking on the entry in the progress-indicator or when the task is
> finished show the application again.
> 
> > (As a comparison, should we also collect errors from different tasks
> > into a single menu? Why or why not? How about selected text from
> > different tasks? Or the most recently opened file from different tasks?)
> 
> I don't know, but we would need to define whats kind of things should be shown.
> 
> > The Dash is hidden by default, and the launcher is usually hidden. Do
> > you think it is reasonable to hide the clock most of the time?
> I don't know. That's why i asked that question at the bottom.
> For me it would be ok to move the mouse to the left to see the clock.
> But i have absolutely no idea how others think about that. It would be like in
> windows when you have your taskbar set to autohide. Except that windows
> doesn't hide it per default and we do.
> 
> > Your arrangement would hide it even when it is discharging.
> as i said in the example at the top it would show the indicator when
> discharging and hide it again when charging.
> 
> > Does that mean it should be shown by default?
> I don't think. But i mentioned it here because someone has maybe a
> nice idea for that.We could show it as soon as you start an
> application that can play music.(If there is at least on application
> in Sound-Settings -> Applications)
> 
> > How does this relate to indicator menus?
> Not at all.I write this because if like in my idea we want to have the
> minimum possible amount
> of indicators with a feature like that all indicators that are only
> there to hide an application could be removed
> 
> > Hmm, that seems a little bit backwards. Usually when music starts
> > playing, it's because you told it to play, so you don't need a
> > notification in that case.
> Here too what i wanted to say is that the sound-indicator should fade
> in. But no notification bubble should be shown.
> (While listening to music you might want to adjust the volume)
> 
> > On the other hand, the sound menu currently
> > lets you quickly start music playing in the first place -- and it
> > wouldn't be nearly so quick if it was hidden by default.
> That's one of the reasons why i said for some people it could become
> annoying. Don't know what to do about this.
> Maybe people who listen a lot of music could put their musicplayer in
> the launcher and start
> playing music from the quicklist?
> 
> > I haven't yet seen an application where this is a problem. Do you know
> > of one?
> No. but when i see how many indicators Roland has there are maybe
> applications with problems.
> 
> > That in particular is an interesting idea. But if you used the menu to
> > connect to one wi-fi network, but then realized you should have
> > connected to another one instead (that happened to me last week), the
> > menu wouldn't be there any more.
> That's why you can always expand system indicators by clicking on the arrow.
> They are just hidden but not gone.
> 
> > It would be rather strange that a Me menu (that Ubuntu doesn't even
> > have any more!) would be visible by default, but a clock would not.
> With me menu it didn't mean to use it 100% like we had it.
> That's why i added like gnome-shell.
> What if we would remove the "me menu" and show the clock instead?
> A problem that i see with that approach is that people will not expect a
> menuentry to shut down their pc when clicking at the clock.
> But maybe we could put shutdown at the dashs' first page?
> Nice day
> David Reichling
> 
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