lubuntu-desktop team mailing list archive

[Jonathan Marsden <jmarsden@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 11/12/2011 04:20 PM, amjjawad HOOHAA wrote:

>> This mailing list is more likely to be seen and responded to by Lubuntu
>> developers than forum threads, IMO.


> I do respect your opinion and I do understand what you are saying and I
> also see your point but ... have you checked how many users have actually
> posted over that thread? and they are still doing that on daily basis? I
> hope you do :)


Expecting Lubuntu devs to also do significant amounts of end user
communication/liasion/publicity tasks is asking a lot of them.  It makes
more sense to let those with the passion/skill/vision for such
communication work do that work, or at least most that work, doesn't it?

I prefer that information of interest to me comes *to* me, so that I do
not have to remember to go out and check whether there may be some at N
different web forums or other "pull" media sources.  It saves me time
and energy, and lets me use tools to manage that information flow that I
choose and know well and have used for years (such as my email client)
not tools that someone else chose (web forum software, which seems
different on every forum).

That's a personal choice, of course, but a preference for email over web
forums is pretty common among developers and other technically oriented
folks.  You asked whether you should post your "suggestions" here or on
forums, so I offered you my opinion on which one is more likely to be
useful, and why.

If you want to take on a role of "liasion" between forum users and
developers, and you have all the necessary skills (both technical and
social), respect (among both users and developers) and available time to
do that work well, then great, go for it!  More generally, you sound
like someone who might consider joining the proposed Lubuntu "Comm
Team", that is mentioned in the P-Plan wiki page which I linked to in my
earlier email.

Note that decisions on overall direction for Lubuntu 12.04 were already
made, at UDS, and are already incorporated into blueprint(s).  This is
how all Ubuntu flavours operate, Lubuntu is not a "special exception" to
this Ubuntu-standard development process.

> Plus, when I posted over there, I could simple have done it here but
> I did that over there to be just like them and be one of them and add
> my voice to their voice. Being a member of Lubuntu (NO, I'm not a
> developer - too bad I'm not) and be so close to users IS IMHO VERY
> important, period.


See above re. your choosing to act as liasion or becoming involved in
the "Comm Team" :)

I don't disagree that users matter -- of course they matter; but some of
us have real world jobs, personal or medical issues, and lives outside
Ubuntu that restrict our available time for Lubuntu... IMO it is better
that I spend the limited time I have on Lubuntu doing the things I can
do which few others can do.

I do get regular contact with real Linux users; I am a member of a local
Linux User Group and frequently give talks there and help out local
users, several of whom use Ubuntu in one flavour or another.

> I did that I did as a Lubuntu User. Please, don't look at it as a
> feedback or suggestion from a fellow member of the same team :)


To be useful, "suggestions" from Lubuntu users need to be very clear and
specific, and the sheer volume of them is rather overwhelming for a very
small development team.  Encouraging good bug reporting (on LaunchPad,
not in forums!) and good troubleshooting skills among users is, IMO,
likely to do more to help Lubuntu than encouraging end users to make
"suggestions", many of which are simply not practical without a much
larger development team that Lubuntu currently has.

If you have the time to learn development skills, and then become an
Lubuntu developer, that would be a great contribution to make.

Encouraging "suggestions" from large numbers of end users on forums is
IMO likely to disappoint and even upset those end users, when their
well-intentioned suggestions do not make it into the next release.
Encouraging good clear specific bug reports, and good troubleshooting
skills, helps users manage their systems well, and helps developers
learn about, diagnose and fix bugs.

Again, this is just my opinion.

>>> If there is any kind of updates about 12.04, please let me know.
>> Please don't make extra work for our scarce and overworked
>> developers :)
> Sorry but don't really know what to comment here so I'll remain
> silent.

Asking Julien to keep you updated, when you can instead ask existing
working automated systems (wiki and Launchpad blueprints) to keep you
updated, is (IMO) a bad idea; Julien's time is immensely valuable.
Those automated systems are there precisely so no-one needs to ask for
manual project status updates from developers.  Please use them.  Does
that make sense?

> Sorry if my suggestions caused any confusion and/or delay, my bad.


It was not the suggestions I was referring to, rather it was the request
to Julien to keep you updated.

Jonathan