lubuntu-qa team mailing list archive

[Nio Wiklund <nio.wiklund@xxxxxxxxx>]

On 2013-10-18 14:11, JM wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Oct 2013 08:39:31 +0200
> Nio Wiklund <nio.wiklund@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Mélodie,
> 
> Hi Nio,
> 
> 
>> 1. You have started with your French thread. Let us hope there will be
>> clear answers to it!
> 
> 
> One answer but no information yet.
> 
> 
>> 2. Maybe, but I'm not sure, Phill is right, that we must focus on one
>> single method that should fit for most newcomers. So I suggest that the
>> next step for you is to test the following methods (in a dedicated
>> computer or a virtual machine). When you have tested them, you have a
>> much better possibility to take part in a decision what we should focus
>> on (one or maybe two methods), and then if improvements are necessary
>>
>> - improved scripts
>> - new or improved help texts (for example wiki pages)
>> - publicity to attact new users ...
> 
> 
> Let's see.
> 
> 
> 
>> 3. I think that all these methods, that work for non-PAE kernels, are
>> actually suitable for all old and middle-aged computers for dedicated
>> single boot systems. (Dual boot makes things more complicated, and in
>> the case of MacOS, Windows 8 and UEFI much more complicated.)
>>
>> Mörgæes's method and the 'grub-n-iso' method work for dual booting too,
>> but not with UEFI.
>>
>> I think the 'installed system' and One Button Installer are very simple
>> to use and likely to succeed, and they make an installed system directly
>> instead of creating an installed system like the ordinary installers do.
>> It is more like flashing the operating system of a mobile phone. But the
>> methods are different from standard installers, which might confuse users.
>>
>> Here is the list again (you recognize it from an earlier mail). At the
>> moment there are at least four ways to install systems with fake-PAE,
>> described indirectly by
>>
>> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu-fake-PAE
>>
>> a. The method by Mörgæs at
>> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PAE
>>
>> b. Grub-n-iso
>> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/grub-n-iso
>>
>> c. Installed system
>> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstalledSystemFakePAE
>>
>> d. One Button Installer
>> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2172971
>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw/OBI
> 
> 
> I tell you what is lacking : for each method presented, a description of the type of case
> the method is meant for would be most welcome. Provided that some of the methods may fit
> better "for a single boot on single hard drive", or "single boot on a machine having two
> hard drives", and so on... a description of the type of case it fits best would help
> picking up one.

You don't know what descriptions there are before you have read the
documentation at those links. I mean that you need to read the existing
documents before saying what is lacking. I think a lot of information is
already available, but it needs to be concentrated or put into some kind
of hierachy (for example a wiki page with sub-pages).

And before doing that we have to find out or decide, what we really
think about the different methods. It is hard to do that alone,
particularly for a person who made one of the systems. I understand what
I have made and find it very simple. Even if it is, the description is
not detailed enough for a newcomer. If you and someone else ask
questions or even write the description/manual, it will probably be much
better for newcomers.

> Prior would be providing the people a clear way to find out first, if they have a machine
> which needs fake-pae to use the one Ubuntu distro X Y Z (X Y and Z need to be described,
> such as "from Ubuntu 12.10 and up, including Ubuntu, Xubuntu, Lubuntu, Ubuntu Studio...
> and so on... ")
> 
> The number of possibilities don't bother me: just a way to pick the most relevant is
> needed (the people who arrived up to the page or the doc are not dumb, and even when they
> are new comers they more or less well know how to ask help on the forums when they don't
> have a LUG close to their place, but there need to be a start to rely on: the cases, or
> examples of cases, or both cases and examples... )

I agree to most of this, but I don't understand LUG, what is that?

>> *. How to install image files: Reverse the way they were created, in the
>> case of 'my' img.gz and img.xz files, there is help using the
>> shell-script 'mkusb' from
>>
>> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1958073
>>
>> Or directly like this
>>
>> sudo -s                 # enter superuser prompt
>> zcat dd-sdb.img.gz | dd bs=4096 of=/dev/sdx
>> sync                    # and wait for the command prompt
>> exit                    # exit superuser prompt
>>
>> and for xz compressed files substitute the zcat line by
>>
>> xzcat dd-sdb.img.xz | dd bs=4096 of=/dev/sdx
>>
>> But beware, dd is nick-named 'disk destroyer'! It does what you tell it
>> to do without questions. If you tell it to do something else than you
>> intended to do, you might wipe a system, that is not backed up. This is
>> why I recommend using the shell-script 'mkusb'.
> 
> 
> The only case I use dd is when I want to make an ISO file out of a CD or a DVD. I will
> never use it to install to a stick or to a hard drive. (I can use the Ubuntu gui when it
> works, or a manual method by mounting the iso to loop then copying the files from the
> mount directory to the usb stick partition, and installing grub to the usb pendrive
> manually as well).

If you don't like to use dd naked, use mkusb to wrap it up :-)

> Can you produce a spin of Lubuntu with fake pae included, in the shape of an ISO file?

No, for fundamental reasons.

1. Fake-PAE is not activated when syslinux checks and finds no PAE flag.

2. 'Grub-n-iso' can boot via grub and the standard PAE kernel even
without the PAE flag. Maybe this is what you want.

3. I don't want to make a re-spin (alias own distro). There are enough
of those, for example Mint, Bodhi, LXLE. I want to keep it simple and
within the territory of the official Ubuntu flavours.

 If
> not, would you want me to make a Ubuntu Openbox Remix with it inside at some time in the
> future ?

1. You can try :-) I don't know how to do it, but it does not mean that
it is impossible.

2. You might also succeed by simply using your existing iso file with
'grub-n-iso' (if your iso can be booted from grub, 'hybrid' iso files
have that capability).

3. A third alternative is to tweak your system until you are happy with
it and make a tarball with and for the One Button Installer, the OBI.
This is very easy compared to remastering a system.

(I do only LTS Precise so far, and I'm waiting for the next Ubuntu Mini
Remix to
> start doing a try on Saucy, but you could grab the openbox remix I did lately and upgrade
> it to see if all still works well and can be remixed - you can also easily install all
> lubuntu-desktop on top of it, of course). 
> 
> Thanks for the mails and all the work. (I'll get into the details of your mails later
> during the week-end, can't do it all at once for the time being).

You are welcome :-)

> Two more things: I added info on the French thread, but I am unsure if there is yet a
> thread about Fake PAE on the qa-lubuntu mailing list? I only saw the kernel non pae
> thread?

If we add lubuntu-qa as recipient, this thread will be it. I think it
has a relevant subject already. Otherwise make a subject and send it to
lubuntu-qa.

> The other thing : phillw told me on the chan you could be the person to ask : I have not
> found out how to customize the isolinux theme in the Live the right way.

What do you want to customize? The splash, the background, the window
decorations ... ? Consider using an installed system on a pendrive
instead of a persistent live system :-)

 And I noticed
> Lubuntu does not display the first image that bothers me so much, the one with the access
> to keyboard or to accessibility (don't even know how that works either).

1. Do you mean the first splash with languages in syslinux?

2. Or the menu in syslinux, where you select what to do and can add boot
options?

3. Or do you mean the grub menu?

4. Or do you mean the log in screen where you can select session,
language, visual aid at the top right corner?

Do you have the
> knowledge about how the isolinux directory is built exactly, especially the theme? If you
> do, could you teach me how to deal with it?

I'm sorry, the answer is no.

> I noticed in the bootlogo archive of the isolinux directory, when extracted, inside there
> is a single file named "init" which is a compiled file, and it seems (according to grep)
> that there might be a png image compiled in it?

init is also the very first program started, when linux is running
(pid=1). Maybe that is what you see, and there happens to be a sequence
of the three letters png in the binary code. But I don't know.

> I have been browsing the web regularly since a long time and I never found a doc or a
> clear answer. :?
> 
> Regards,
> Mélodie
>