openerp-community team mailing list archive

[Fabien Pinckaers <fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

forwarding the answer of nhomar that I think is great.

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	Re: [Openerp-community] About OpenERP Enterprise contract value...
Date: 	Sat, 22 Feb 2014 12:02:15 -0600
From: 	Nhomar Hernández <nhomar@xxxxxxxxx>
To: 	Eric Caudal <eric.caudal@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
CC: 	Carlos Vásquez <carlos.vasquez@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Fabien Pinckaers
<fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>, Fabrice Henrion <fhe@xxxxxxxxxxx>, Igor Cardoso
<ica@xxxxxxxxxxx>




2014-02-21 23:08 GMT-06:00 Eric Caudal <eric.caudal@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:eric.caudal@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>>:

    Hi OpenERP Partners,
    There has been some questioning about the OpenERP Enterprise
    Contract after some of Fabien's email and there is a real
    debate/questioning about the value that this contract brings to the
    final customer.


Hello.

I have the 3 type of generic customers:

- Little ones. (Less than 6 or 4 users).
- Middle Ones. (More than 20 Users).
- Big ones. (More than 200 Users).

Lets share my experience in line thanks to ideas shared by Carlos and Eric.

If you see how much the world is ready to pay (and is paying) some stuff
comes alive with more sense.

We have applications on competitors with only 10% ready to use
applications of what we have in OpenERP that cost the full price only
these applications, (CRM and Project as an example), then when you sum
all these apps separately for a customer it can bring even from 200 to
250 usd/usr.

We have sold little quantity of enterprises, but we include always as
part of the agreement our own plain services too, then I can manage the
relationship with plain costs (It works for me very well).

I saw several people failing in deliver good services after 7 or 8
Enterprise sold because they don't have included these services as part
of the total cost of ownership, and customer ask for plain mantainance
services which is clear but it is that "a service".

We DON'T have any competitor around the world that can offer "plain"
cost for bug fixing. Why  is not for our customers this a good added
value?, I understand there are big exceptions.

We have other specific tools, As administrative tools for example, that
cost less that 39 usd/usr month in these world is a little more difficult.

Then I just want to put my experience on the table to allow have a
bigger spectrum.

About Carlos words.

Yes IMHO, we in our specific countries can manage the job as a "channel"
to allow OpenERP and us be profitable, we are preparing an offer for our
two countries too, and it was impossible  comply with a profitable
agreement for everybody too, but we need to go alive first to be sure
they were right or wrong, it means all what i can say today is simply
speculative, because they have real number rolling we don't.

About Eric words.

My friend, i just recommend to you avoid to think you are shitting your
customers, make the numbers in a real way as a company, and you will see
more clear the Value added with the price.

But yes if we buy an Enterprise and we don't use it correctly "Which I
think should be taught as part of the 1st enterprise" you feel in this
way (I did in some point). We can talk about these topic if you want in
spanish a little deeper (i english is too difficult to me).

About Some generic issues.

What IMHO should happen is that OpenERP need to move faster with
services, it means, better MP process, better answers, best quality on
services, some pre-configured/tested scenarios (as part of Enterprise)
these are NOT code, just configured data.

But at the end of the day the MAIN issue is that some "numeric analysis"
start from the principle of OpenERP is available For Free, and we as key
community members must be the protagonists of ensure it continue being
in that way, buy Enterprises ensures that, ensure End user a continuous
Evolution of the software, and extraordinary marketing approach for us
(well at least theoretically speaking).

About other options I tested.

I see people that prefer mantain closed the code because "they" invest
in these 4 or 5 hundreds of lines AND never buy OpenERP services because
one reason or another, then when tool evolve and broke these
developments they complain as they have the "right" to do it, we should
as community NOT encourage that, and our message must be overwhelming
about that, not calling them leechers or something like that, but using
some specific maketing option to encourage put everybody in the same
roadmap.

The main issue is that some times (just some times not always) OpenERP
include everybody on these bag of people that complain without reason
and it is not right.

I think the Open Source (as one time Fabien told me) is more an "State
of Mind" and we always must include these state of mind in our "Cost
Structure" because even the democracy has a cost ;-), Venezuela is a
good example of what can become a society that want EVERYTHING for free
and it is the only feature that Government and Opposition have in
common, RESUT.

Other tools that are by far less advanced take even more money than
OpenERP "Why our users can not have a model to do the same with
OpenERP?" OpenSource is not a matter of price is a matter of "Open The
Code, and Open The process".

About our internal numbers.

With the sum of all our internal numbers and enterprise sold, we are
mantaining today +350 modules in all our projects, and really it is not
enought yet, re-write them, fix them, migrate them to a fixed price....
we are achieving the deal already (it means we are in our break even
point) regarding to Enterprise Licences Sold, but I think if everybody
comply with the rules OpenERP prices must come down, in the middle we
need to resist with this status quo.

About OpenERP quality of services.

The Experience has demonstrated to me that Enterprise is NOT a matter of
who CAN DO the job, is a matter of who DO the job, and It is a work
"shared" between OpenERP and the Partner/customer, it means, both parts
must to take equal or similar quantity of money contract by contract.

I have something like 60% of success with this approach, it means I
comply with the objective of "outsource" the job of fix and migrate at a
plain price, it brings me some specific good profit, I think with twice
the enterprises I have today I will increase these number, but we can
not do that if not everybody play the same game.

What services I should include in Enterprise, for the future?

1.- Preconfigured/Pretested stuff.
2.- Best administrative tools "as Eric told"
3.- A "Good" reseller model, where even I can manage by myself them.
4.- Best merge proposals process, it means, stop encourage the patch
process.
5.- Automation tools, only for who buy enterprise (open sourced but
available only for who pays).

I hope it helps. Regards.

PS: I sent this privately because I think it is a business discussion
and not a "Community" discussion.
-- 
--------------------
Saludos Cordiales

Nhomar G. Hernandez M.
+58-414-4110269 <tel:%2B58-414-4110269>
Skype: nhomar00
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