The thing I just figured out is that the weed brought by the venture
capitalists was of a very high quality!
You should at least share it with us! Cause we're not on the same trip!
On May 19, 2014 7:30 PM, "Fabien Pinckaers" <fp@xxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
On 05/19/2014 02:54 PM, TeMPO Consulting wrote:
> Hello Fabien
>
> after attending two webminars and reading all the mail related to
> pricing I still have two major questions
>
> 1. are the prices listed at https://www.odoo.com/page/pricing
related
> to the SaaS offer or to Odoo Enterprise, or both ?
Both. We want to keep the same price/contract in order to not create
pricing competition between both. It also allows people to switch from
saas to on-premise without having to change their contracts.
> 2. if they also apply to Odoo Enterprise what is the SLA
provided by
> the "Community Support" ?
What do you mean by community support?
>
> many thanks for your reply.
>
> Maurice MORETTI
>
>>> Basic math for a client with 20 users and 5 apps for 24 months:
>>> * 20 users x 5 apps x 24 months x $15 = $36,000
>>> * Partner commission for 24 months (~50%)= $18,000
>> No, this is a common usecase:
>>
>> Here is a typical use case (with old pricing), 40 users:
>> - Public Price: $18720
>> - Partner Price: $9360 (a ready partner)
>> - Price sold to customer: $13.000
>> - Implementation Cost: $90.000
>>
>> Maintenance part of the TCO: 12.6%
>> Commission part of the TCO: 3.5%
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 11:47 AM, Fabien Pinckaers
<fp@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> <mailto:fp@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:fp@xxxxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I just wrote a blog to explain the new pricing:
>>> https://www.odoo.com/blog/1/post/158
>>>
>>> Please read it before going further in this email.
>>>
>>>
>>> I'll try to answer most questions here:
>>>
>>> 1/ How to compute the price?
>>>
>>> The price is: # total of users X # of apps bundle X 12EUR
>>>
>>> 2/ Why don't we charge according to real usage? (e.g.: 5
users on CRM, 3
>>> on accounting, 7 on projects?)
>>>
>>> Because it's impossible to predict for yearly contracts!
Quoting would
>>> become a nightmare and a lot of people would abuse from
this unclear
>>> situation. (a customer would start with a low price but
three month
>>> after we would have to upsell him because of the number of
users on some
>>> apps)
>>>
>>> Lets take the following use case: a company of 10 users
that uses CRM,
>>> accounting, projects. They have 3 sales person, 4
consultants, 1
>>> director, 1 secretary and 1 accountant.
>>>
>>> When you do a quote for this customer, how many users do
they have per
>>> application?
>>> - is the director using accounting and CRM?
>>> - can the sales have read access to project for
follow-ups to their
>>> customers?
>>> - can the accounting check sales orders coming from the
sales?
>>> - is it the secreatary that give access rights to others
users?
>>>
>>> I checked in our production database. We have 7 persons
working in the
>>> marketing department. If one do a quote of 7 users for the
marketing
>>> application bundle, it's totally under-estimated.
>>>
>>> In reality, we have 45 users on marketing application, not 7:
>>> - the Professional Service team that built the
certification sample
>>> exam on the website (survey)
>>> - users that train others users on features
>>> - managers that need statistics about events, mass
mailing, ...
>>> - most sales need an access to check prospects on events,
>>> - system administrator need an access to allocate access
rights and
>>> test for others users
>>>
>>> 3/ Is it expensive?
>>>
>>> Absolutly not. It's 2x to 3x cheaper than the market
average. Check this
>>> comparison of software vendors:
>>> https://www.odoo.com/website/image/ir.attachment/537400/datas
>>>
>>> Moreover, partners get 50% to 60% discount on the public
price. It means
>>> gold partners pay only 4.8EUR / $6 per user and per
application. Whatever
>>> the market, it's super cheap and super competitive.
>>>
>>>
>>> 4/ Is it an increase of the price?
>>>
>>> For some customers: no. (1-3 apps)
>>> For some customers: yes.
>>>
>>> The biggest increase would be around 2x more for one
particular customer
>>> that uses a lot of applications. (6) I never saw a company
running 10
>>> apps and if they do, it's normal that they pay 120EUR per
user because the
>>> value they get from Odoo is huge. No other product can
offer this.
>>>
>>>
>>> 5/ localization & customization
>>>
>>> Odoo has a lot of huge advantages compared to traditional
ERPs:
>>> - higher scope: website, ecommerce, cubes analysis, CRM, ...
>>> - better usability, faster implementation
>>> - better flexibility: allows custom development and high
level config
>>>
>>> Odoo also has a few disadvantages compared to traditional
ERPs, the main
>>> one is the localization in some countries. (something we
will fix for v9
>>> as we will massively invest in accounting l18n)
>>>
>>> Odoo has a lot of PROS and a few CONs. But the few CONs
are largely
>>> compensated by the PROs. As the product is better,
economics tell us
>>> that the product must be more expensive.
>>>
>>> Not only we are not more expensive, but we are at least 2x
to 3x
>>> cheaper. And, if you take the partner price 4.8EUR per
user and per app,
>>> we are 6x cheaper than the competition!
>>>
>>> I do not know a lot of industry where a product can be 2X
cheaper for a
>>> better quality.
>>>
>>> One should not be frustrated about the price.
>>>
>>> @marcelo
>>> > I recently read the posts by the Compiere founder
explaining what
>>> > went wrong after he got VC money. Read it and it will
look like it is
>>> > all happening again.
>>> Every time we do a change in the community people cry:
take care of
>>> forks, read Jorge's blog, VCs are evil, OpenERP does not
understand its
>>> users...
>>>
>>> Odoo is not comparable to Compiere/Tryton/Openbravo or
others. The
>>> sustainability of a product is not related at all with
fork threats,
>>> failure of others open source software or what ever.
>>>
>>> The sustainability of every product is directly linked to
it's ability
>>> to create a sustainable model where partners and
publishers get enough
>>> revenues to grow their activities on the product.
>>>
>>> This requires a lot of things like: having a great product
allowing good
>>> service margins, a good price for the publisher, happy
customers, etc.
>>>
>>> > What kind of business puts potential clients in
front of active
>>> > paying clients? The model is wrong wrong wrong.
>>>
>>> What's wrong is to have a pricing so cheap that it does
not allow to
>>> sustain the development of the product, or too few
customers because the
>>> product is not competitive. That's what killed some products.
>>>
>>> > If Odoo was a ready-to-use software then the model
would make a
>>> > lot of sense. But they are ignoring the importance of
localization &
>>> > customization. If I wanted off the shelf software I
wouldn't bother
>>> > going open source.
>>>
>>> Our customers don't choose Odoo beause it's open source.
They choose
>>> Odoo because it's better (products and/or servives of
partners)
>>>
>>> We should stop being frustrated of being open source. It's
not because
>>> we are open source that we should be cheaper. The only
thing that
>>> matters for a customer is to have a great product at an
affordable
>>> price.
>>>
>>> Open Source is not a customer value, it's a way to develop
better
>>> products.
>>>
>>>
>>> > Also, this thing that partners will not get
any commission
>>> > on contracts with more than two years is REALLY
nonsense. It
>>> > essentially means that the contract will become
50% more
>>> > expensive on the 3rd year because the partner
will need that
>>> > revenue back and of course it will be important
for the client
>>> > to keep bonds with the partner. It is really sad
when
>>> companies
>>> > pull this sort of crap on their "partners".
>>>
>>> My understanding is that partners don't sell Odoo
Enterprise because of
>>> their commissions. They sell it because they need it for
their customers
>>> and because this allows them to sell more services. (and
this is how it
>>> should be)
>>>
>>> The part of the commission on Odoo Enterprise is usually
lower than 4%
>>> of the revenue a partner take on a project. So, their
motivation is not
>>> on the commission.
>>>
>>> I may be wrong. I am open to discuss this during the
community days.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hope it helps better understanding this strategic move,
>>> Thanks for the feedback,
>>>
>>> --
>>> Fabien Pinckaers
>>> Odoo Founder
>>>
>>> Phone: +32.81.81.37.00 <tel:%2B32.81.81.37.00>
>>> Web: https://www.odoo.com
>>> Twitter: @fpopenerp
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
>>> Post to : openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> <mailto:openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Très cordialement
>
> Maurice MORETTI
>
>
_________________________________________________________________________
> TeMPO CONSULTING 20, avenue de la Paix 67000 Strasbourg FRANCE
>
> Web : http://www.tempo-consulting.fr
> email : mm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:mm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> Tel : 33 (0)3 88 56 82 10
> Fax : 33 (0)3 88 56 46 64
> Mobile : 33 (0)6 08 61 85 02
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
> Post to : openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>
--
Fabien Pinckaers
Odoo Founder
Phone: +32.81.81.37.00 <tel:%2B32.81.81.37.00>
Web: https://www.odoo.com
Twitter: @fpodoo
_______________________________________________
Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
Post to : openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
<https://launchpad.net/%7Eopenerp-community>
More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
_______________________________________________
Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
Post to : openerp-community@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community
More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
