openstack team mailing list archive

[Gabe Westmaas <gabe.westmaas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I think this thing we call zones is fundamentally different from an Availability Zone or a Host Aggregate.  An Availability Zone is about redundancy, a Host Aggregate is about capabilities, and a Zone is about infrastructure performance.  I could easily imagine an Availability Zone larger than a Zone, and vice versa, thus I want to be cautious about talking about the relationships between them.  And I think host aggregates are way too powerful an idea to keep inside either of those boxes as well.

In the new implementation we don't have entire openstack deployments - we have parts of an openstack deployment.  Hypervisors, DB, and the queuing service are all that are the new Zones.  Words that make the most sense to me are words that talk about that split rather than words that talk about location or aggregation.

Slice, section, segment, sector, division, partition - something along those lines.

Gabe

-----Original Message-----
From: openstack-bounces+gabe.westmaas=rackspace.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:openstack-bounces+gabe.westmaas=rackspace.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Armando Migliaccio
Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2012 6:36 AM
To: Martin Paulo; Jay Pipes
Cc: openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [Openstack] Remove Zones code - FFE

-1 for ServerGroup because in the OSAPI terminology Server is a guest instance rather than a physical host.

I assume that the relationship between zone and availability zone will still exist (and I remind you that host-aggregates have been coming along to). So you have:

?? <--> Availability Zones <--> Host Aggregates 

How about ?? == Deployment [Slice | Area | or Section]

I know that Region may not be liked by some people, but that is good too.

Armando

> -----Original Message-----
> From: 
> openstack-bounces+armando.migliaccio=eu.citrix.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:openstack-
> bounces+armando.migliaccio=eu.citrix.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On 
> bounces+Behalf Of
> Martin Paulo
> Sent: 14 February 2012 23:34
> To: Jay Pipes
> Cc: openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [Openstack] Remove Zones code - FFE
> 
> ServerGroup gets my vote at the moment: it's a term that has an 
> overloaded meaning (as far as I know)
> 
> Martin
> 
> On 15 February 2012 06:25, Jay Pipes <jaypipes@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > -1 on shard b/c of database terminology. -1 on cluster because of 
> > HPC and database terminology.
> >
> > Zone was originally used because it is general -- referring to 
> > merely a collection of hosts or other zones and not having a 
> > geographic connotation like Region does.
> >
> > Other possibilities:
> >
> > * Container (not recommended, as it is overloaded with Solaris or 
> > Linux container virtualization)
> > * ServerGroup
> > * HostGroup
> > * Group
> > * Collection
> >
> > If Zone isn't used, I suppose I would prefer ServerGroup
> >
> > -jay
> >
> >
> > On 02/13/2012 08:45 PM, Yun Mao wrote:
> >>
> >> agreed..
> >>
> >> -1 on shard, +1 on cluster
> >>
> >> Yun
> >>
> >> On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 7:59 PM, Martin 
> >> Paulo<martin.paulo@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Please not 'shards'
> >>> Sharding as a concept is so intertwined with databases IMHO that 
> >>> it will serve to confuse even more. Why not 'cluster'?
> >>>
> >>> Martin
> >>>
> >>> On 13 February 2012 09:50, Chris Behrens<cbehrens@xxxxxxxxxxxx>  wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Sorry, I'm late.  Really getting down to the wire here. :)
> >>>>
> >>>> I've thrown up a version here:
> >>>> https://review.openstack.org/#change,4062
> >>>>
> >>>> I've not functionally tested it yet, but there's really good test 
> >>>> coverage for the zones service itself.   I also have added a 
> >>>> test_compute_zones which tests that all of the compute tests pass 
> >>>> while using the new ComputeZonesAPI class.
> >>>>
> >>>> There's a couple bugs I note in the review and then I think I'm 
> >>>> missing pushing some instance updates to the top in libvirt code.
> >>>> And missing an update for instance deletes in the compute manager.
> >>>> Going to hit those up today and finish this off.
> >>>>
> >>>> One other comment:  It's been suggested we not call this stuff 'Zones'
> >>>> anymore.  It gets confused with availability zones and so forth.
> >>>> Since this is really a way to shard nova, it has been suggested 
> >>>> to call
> this 'Shards'.
> >>>> :)   Not sure I dig that name completely, although it makes sense.
> >>>>  Thoughts?
> >>>>
> >>>> - Chris
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Feb 9, 2012, at 10:29 AM, Leandro Reox wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Awesome Chrisssss !!!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Lean
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 3:26 PM, Alejandro 
> >>>>> Comisario<alejandro.comisario@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>  wrote:
> >>>>> Niceee !!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Alejandro.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 02/09/2012 02:02 PM, Chris Behrens wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I should be pushing something up by end of day...  Even if it's 
> >>>>>> not granted an FFE, I'll have a need to keep my branch updated 
> >>>>>> and working, so I should at least always have a branch pushed 
> >>>>>> up to a github account somewhere until F1 opens up.  So, I 
> >>>>>> guess worst case... there'll be a branch somewhere for you to 
> >>>>>> play with. :)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> - Chris
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 3:21 PM, Tom Fifield wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Just raising another deployment waiting on this new Zone 
> >>>>>>> implementation - we currently have 2000 cores sitting idle in 
> >>>>>>> another datacentre that we can use "better" if this is done.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> How can we help? ;)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Tom
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On 02/08/2012 07:30 PM, Ziad Sawalha wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> We were working on providing the necessary functionality in 
> >>>>>>>> Keystone but stopped when we heard of the alternative solution.
> >>>>>>>> We could resume the conversation about what is needed on the 
> >>>>>>>> Keystone side and implement if needed.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Z
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> From: Sandy Walsh<
> >>>>>>>> sandy.walsh@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>> <mailto:sandy.walsh@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2012 01:49:58 +0000
> >>>>>>>> To: Joshua McKenty<
> >>>>>>>> joshua@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>> <mailto:joshua@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> , Vishvananda Ishaya
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> <
> >>>>>>>> vishvananda@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:vishvananda@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Cc: "
> >>>>>>>> openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> <mailto:openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>"<openstack@lists.launc
> >>>>>>>> hp ad.net <mailto:openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Openstack] Remove Zones code - FFE
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Understood, timing is everything. I'll let Chris talk about 
> >>>>>>>> expected timing for the replacement. From a deployers side, 
> >>>>>>>> nothing would really change, just some configuration options 
> >>>>>>>> ... but a replacement should be available.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I'm sure we could get it working pretty easily. The Keystone 
> >>>>>>>> integration was the biggest pita.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I can keep this branch fresh with trunk for when we're ready 
> >>>>>>>> to pull the trigger.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> -S
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>> ---------
> >>>>>>>> *From:* Joshua McKenty [
> >>>>>>>> joshua@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>> <mailto:joshua@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> ]
> >>>>>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 01, 2012 4:45 PM
> >>>>>>>> *To:* Vishvananda Ishaya
> >>>>>>>> *Cc:* Sandy Walsh;
> >>>>>>>> openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> >>>>>>>> <mailto:openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Openstack] Remove Zones code - FFE
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> +1 to Vish's points. I know there are some folks coming 
> >>>>>>>> +online in
> >>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>> Folsom timeline that can help out with the new stuff, but 
> >>>>>>>> this feels a bit like going backwards.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>> Joshua McKenty, CEO
> >>>>>>>> Piston Cloud Computing, Inc.
> >>>>>>>> w: (650) 24-CLOUD
> >>>>>>>> m: (650) 283-6846
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> http://www.pistoncloud.com
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> "Oh, Westley, we'll never survive!"
> >>>>>>>> "Nonsense. You're only saying that because no one ever has."
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, February 1, 2012 at 12:41 PM, Vishvananda 
> >>>>>>>> Ishaya
> >>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I am all for pulling this out, but I'm a bit concerned with 
> >>>>>>>>> the fact that we have nothing to replace it with. There are 
> >>>>>>>>> some groups still trying to use it. MercadoLibre is trying 
> >>>>>>>>> to use it for example. I know you guys are trying to replace 
> >>>>>>>>> this with something better, but it would be nice not to 
> >>>>>>>>> break people for 7+ months
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> So I guess I have some questions:
> >>>>>>>>> 1.a) is the current implementation completely broken?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> 1.b) if yes, is it fixable
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> 2) If we do remove this, what can we tell people that need 
> >>>>>>>>> something like zones between now and the Folsom release?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Vish
> >>>>>>>>> On Feb 1, 2012, at 12:16 PM, Sandy Walsh wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> As part of the new (and optional) Zones code coming down 
> >>>>>>>>>> the pipe, part of this is to remove the old Zones implementation.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> More info in the merge prop:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> https://review.openstack.org/#change,3629
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> So, can I? can I? Huh?
> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>>>>>>> https://launchpad.net/~openstack
> >>>>>>>>>>
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> >>>>>>>>>> <mailto:openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Unsubscribe :
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> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> More help :
> >>>>>>>>>> https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Post to :
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> >>>>>>>>> <mailto:openstack@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>
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> >>>>>>>>>
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> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> ==================================================================
> >>>
> >>> Martin Paulo, BSc.
> >>> Software Developer
> >>>
> >>> Tel :         +61-3-9434 2508 (Home) Tel :          04 205 20339
> >>> (Mobile)
> >>> Site:          http://www.thepaulofamily.net
> >>>
> >>> "Nobody goes there any more. It's too crowded" - Yogi Berra.
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >>
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> >
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> 
> 
> 
> --
> ==================================================================
> 
> Martin Paulo, BSc.
> Software Developer
> 
> Tel :         +61-3-9434 2508 (Home)
> Tel :          04 205 20339      (Mobile)
> Site:          http://www.thepaulofamily.net
> 
> "Nobody goes there any more. It's too crowded" - Yogi Berra.
> 
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