I feel that the toolbars should only be used where it makes sense. In
the earlier example, it did not make sense to have a thick toolbar for
just a search box.
Having them blend in with the top panel could be seen as a good thing
when the window is active. Both the toolbar and the menu would be
together, and it is worth remembering that the global-menu means that
the panel is integrated with the running application.
When the application becomes inactive, the toolbar could slide upwards
and out of view, like the unity launcher slides to the left at
present. After all, if the application is inactive, the toolbar is not
going to be needed until it becomes active again, in which case the
toolbar can re-appear.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: nrundy@xxxxxxxxxxx
To: ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2011 13:08:40 -0400
Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Oneiric Dark Toolbars waste vertical space -
what was the point of Unity?
The newly implemented Dark Toolbars to Oneiric have left me wondering
if the Developers have forgotten one of the driving principles for
Unity--to reclaim vertical space?
Look at the following comparison between Natty as it is today and
Oneiric with Dark Toolbars. In Oneiric, not only has writing been
placed underneath the icons (taking vertical space) but there is now a
huge/thick vertical-space-wasting "Dark Toolbar" with only one item on
it: the search box. COME ON! I thought the whole point of Unity was to
allow more space for the items in the window. Does everything that
uses Gnome 3.0 have to present enormous amounts of chrome with no
purpose other than to waste vertical space? One of the things I love
about Natty is how much vertical space has been reclaimed. Now it's
looking like all that is going to be gone in Oneiric.
http://imgur.com/a/w9pBQ
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: nrundy@xxxxxxxxxxx
To: ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2011 11:06:08 -0400
Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Oneiric Dark Toolbars are a BAD idea - here's why
Dark Toolbars are a BAD idea. The Top-Panel should remain a
significantly darker color than application toolbars.
Gnome-shell has the right idea where they made the top-panel black,
communicating that the top-panel is NOT part of a running application.
Google has started putting a black top-panel across its webpages,
communicating that the top-panel is NOT part of the search results or
web page's content. These dark top-panels provide an always-present,
constant frame of reference that grounds the user and differentiates
it from the project's focus (i.e., a web search, a web page's content,
or a running application). This grounded focus is lost when Dark
Toolbars are merged to the top-panel.
The Top-Panel is NOT part of a running application. Yet this is
exactly what is communicated to the user when application toolbars are
essentially merged to the Top-Panel. Keeping the top-panel separate
from application toolbars is even more important now because of
Unity's new space-saving design. To move an entire window for example,
a user can click on the Titlebar. Yet dark toolbars would be the same
color as the titlebar. To restore a maximized window, the user can
double-click free space on the top-panel. Yet dark toolbars would
present loads of free space the same color as the Top-Panel. There are
all kinds of problems with choosing Dark Toolbars.
Aesthetically it is also a failure. It shrouds regularly used
tools/buttons in darkness. The buttons and tools should be clearly
visible and accessible by the user. Not hidden in a darkened state.
A better approach would be a gradation of darkening as one moves
toward the top-panel. For example, the top-panel would be a dark color
(like Ambiance). The Toolbar would be a middle color (like the present
cream or maybe a gray), in this way bridging the gap, adding a
gradation, from the lighted/white background where the work is done to
the darker panel. The work area is lighted because that's where the
user's focus is. The toolbar area is darker than the work area because
it is an area of "peripheral" focus for the user as he/she works.
Tools/buttons are referenced and consulted during the work process.
The OS's top-panel is dark because this is an Always-Present constant
that doesn't change, and it is not actively engaged when a user is
working on a project, hence it is black/dark in color. The Toolbars do
NOT share this state. The Toolbars should not be identified with the
Top-Panel.
An Operating System's Top-Panel is NOT the same as an Application's
Toolbar controls. They should not be treated the same visually. Yes,
an application's Global Menu and window controls appear in the
top-panel when maximized. But these are items that are established and
utilized primarily when beginning or ending a work project. A Toolbar
on the other hand is actively engaged during work. For example, when
writing a paper, a user will look up to identify the selected font
name or font size, whether a specific formatting option is engaged,
and so forth. Looking at the Global Menu does not provide visual
feedback like this--hence it makes sense to put it in the Top-Panel
and have it be darkened in color like the Top-Panel. It is
readily accessible by mouse and keyboard shortcut to serve its
purpose. But visually, it has no purpose; hence, one of the driving
forces to move it the top panel and get it out of the way and prevent
it from taking up space. It does not make sense from
a usability standpoint to treat an application's toolbar (which shows
the font name, font size, etc) in a darkened state. There is already a
LOT of dark in ubuntu. Adding more by making the toolbars dark is a
mark against efficient usability and more of an esoteric aesthetic
preference that has nothing to do with usability and functional design.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: jorge.ortega111@xxxxxxxxx
Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2011 22:07:25 +0100
To: ayatana@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Oneiric Dark Toolbars/Menubar Issues
I think it is an interesting solution. I suggested before something a
bit more radical: that every application when open, would create its
own virtual workspace. To do this only for maximised applications is
also, I think, a good idea.
On 21 July 2011 19:36, Jonathan Meek <shrouded.cloud@xxxxxxxxx
<mailto:shrouded.cloud@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
I recently say the post on OMG!Ubuntu! about the possibility of
dark toolbars being included for Oneiric and this sparked an
interesting debate among someone I know who I asked to draft his
thoughts on the issue for post to the Ayatana list for discussion.
Here it is:
PROBLEM:
The management of maximised windows in Unity is principally flawed
and could potentially cause confusion.
This problem arises due to the location of the toolbars of
maximised windows, and the global menu in the Unity panel.
Consider the screenshot at http://cdn.om. Both the toolbar and the
menu would be together, and it is worth remembering that the
global-menu means that the panel is integrated with the running
application.gubuntu.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/2011-07-19-150134_1366x768_scrot-1.png
<http://cdn.omgubuntu.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/2011-07-19-150134_1366x768_scrot-1.png>.
In the screenshot, you can see that because of the dark theming of
the toolbar of the image preview window, it appears to be a part
of the panel and the global menu.
The screenshot demonstrates a situation in which this is
undesirable. It may appear to the user that the toolbar for the
image preview application is a part of the global menu for the
settings application. A similar problem may arise in the event
that a user has, for instance, two documents open in a word
processor, and one maximised behind another unmaximised window. In
this case, it may appear that the toolbar of the window behind
operates on the window in front. This could cause confusion and
annoyance.
SOLUTIONS:
There are a number of potential solutions, including theming
inactive windows differently and displaying the title bar of full
screen windows.
In my opinion, the best solution I have observed is the solution
in use on Mac OS X Lion. Lion creates a dynamic workspace for each
maximised window, in effect treating maximised (or full-screen)
applications as additional workspaces. This means that it is
impossible to end up with a situation where an unmaximised window
is in front of a maximised window.
From Jonathan Rothwell <mailto:jonathan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
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