elementary-dev-community team mailing list archive

[David Gomes <david@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

>There should be a recommended set of tools for a programmer to begin with.
Well, we don't have to recommend anything other than elementary OS.
Recommend using cmake and Vala? No need to recommend those, any new
developer is forced to use those.

What "set of tools" are you recommending? I really want to know what
"libraries" and what "tools" you think would ship with this elementary
OS Developer Version.

Shipping documentation would indeed make it easier for new developers,
but it's just so easy to install the documentation and the libraries
that I don't get why it should be done.

I get your idea guys, I just don't see why it's so "good". I mean, one
of the reasons we base elementary OS on Ubuntu is that we have a
package manager with over thirty thousand packages.

Regarding text editors, we already ship Scratch (which is more than
enough) with elementary OS ;)

On 9/4/12, Voldyman <voldyman666@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> I agree with munchor's dog fooding reference but do not agree with the other
> part.
> When i started contributing to elementary project (which is quite recently
> ;)) i had never done serious linux app development. I came from a mainly web
> and c# for desktop background although after completely moving to linux few
> years ago the c# part had stopped. It was a little hard
> For me to find good tools for development, the guys at #elementary-dev (you
> all) suggested scratch-text-editor which i couldn't you (still can't) so i
> continued using Sublime Text which i had been using for web dev and now i am
> pretty comfortable with it.
>
> There should be a recommended set of tools for a programmer to begin with.
> He/she can later pick up or drop tools according to their preference.
>
> Voldyman
> On 04-Sep-2012, at 11:31 PM, David Gomes <david@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> Shipping more packages in my opinion is anti-developping philosophy. Each
>> developer has his own preferred tools. Shipping more text editors, more
>> libraries, etc is just more bloat in my opinion. Ubuntu and its
>> derivatives have enough bloat already, since most of these distributions
>> ship with more than 2000 packages. In my system I have around 1000
>> packages installed, but it came with around 600.
>>
>> Besides, developers should face bugs. It's the best way we can know about
>> them and fix them (see
>> http://elementaryos.org/journal/eating-our-own-dog-food).
>>
>> If you want the libraries needed for developing our software, just use
>> "sudo apt-get source", any developer should know how to get this kind of
>> tools. Using bazaar to branch and build our tools from source is also
>> something our developers must know how to do.
>>
>> This "iso" has no real advantages in my honest opinion.
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 6:02 PM, Darcy Brás da Silva
>> <dardevelin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> Today while talking to some fine folks at #elementary-dev that go by the
>> handles of
>> victored and voluntatefaber , I wondered if there was any iso build
>> ready to start working/developing
>> for elementary.
>> Now what would be the advantages of having the extra work on getting
>> this iso out.
>>
>> 1) Errors and bugs can be very damaging to a development environment,
>> which lead to a constant fight wen testing highly unstable
>> packages. This makes the developer hell much bigger since everyone tends
>> to test and run this packages in a somewhat different configuration.
>> In case of failure, the developer then needs re-set the development
>> environment to a known stage. This can be very time consuming,
>> that could be in better use.
>> It would also reduce the potential hidden errors, and the known phrase
>> "That's weird, It works in my machine".
>>
>> 2) Individuals that want to start developing in/for elementary could
>> start right away hacking their way in. And if for some reason they mess
>> up big time,
>> guess what ? The iso is right there, re-install, start fresh.
>>
>> Now I am fully aware that maybe this would be a hard work, and possibly
>> limiting to the fact that having everything shipped, would mean larger
>> iso images
>> which then could be "bad" in terms of upload + updated state of the iso.
>> So another idea to support this view would go towards a "Elementary
>> Developer MetaPackage" that would take care of preparing a nice
>> development environment.
>>
>> Please feel free to contact me, on any elementary subject. I'll be glade
>> to reply as soon as I can.
>>
>> --
>> Darcy Brás da Silva <dardevelin@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>
>>
>>
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