kicad-developers team mailing list archive

[Dick Hollenbeck <dick@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 07/23/2012 03:07 PM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
> On 7/23/2012 3:22 PM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote:
>> On 07/23/2012 10:09 AM, Wayne Stambaugh wrote:
>>> On 7/23/2012 9:25 AM, Dick Hollenbeck wrote:
>>>>> Hahaha, good point Dick, anyway, somehow, in Win32 is a common
>>>>> practice to include the python interpreter in many softwares that
>>>>> depend on python, at least the DLL (see point b)
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, my preferences are:
>>>>>
>>>>> a) Ask the users to install Python 2.7.x, and set it on system PATH as
>>>>> a prerequisite, if it's not satisfied during installation just give a
>>>>> link to: [http://www.python.org/getit/], it's just 15MB   [apt-get
>>>>> does that automatically in Linux]
>>>>>
>>>>> b) Bundle the whole Python exe + Python.dll + python basic set of
>>>>> system libraries,
>>>>>
>>>>> c) Bundle only the Python.dll + python basic set of system libraries,
>>>>>
>>>>> d) Statically link Python in kicad + provide the basic set of python
>>>>> system libraries [a good way of wasting system memory]
>>>>>
>>>>> --jokes--
>>>>>
>>>>> e) forcing the users install Linux would save a lot of time, yes, but,
>>>>> poor Win32 and Mac users ;)
>>>>>
>>>>> f) Installing Linux itself [KicadOS!!!, hahaha]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I think that a is better than b,c (even though it needs more user
>>>>> interaction) because the user will have all the system-wide available
>>>>> python modules and libraries, and also kicad functionality will stay
>>>>> available to any other python scripts on the Win32 systems.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, we might take a look to what other Win32 softwares are doing
>>>>> regarding this, and think.
>>>> Good idea.
>>>>
>>>> Blender might be one to look at (but a couple other data points are encouraged also).
>>>> Blender is heavily dependent on python, and has extremely tight scripting integration.
>>>> Does it run on Windows?  If so, something could be learned about what are they doing for
>>>> the poor Windows users.
>>> Bundling the Python interpreter with the windows installer is probably
>>> your safest bet for most users.  The other option I've seen that works
>>> well for power users is to also provide Python specific builds of the
>>> installer.  Take a look at what the Bazaar folks are doing at
>>> http://wiki.bazaar.canonical.com/WindowsDownloads.  It's more work for
>>> the developers building windows installers but it makes life a bit
>>> better for your users.  I tend to error on the side of the user when it
>>> comes to ease of installation.
>>>
>>> Don't feel too bad for those Windows users just yet.  I still do not
>>> have a fully functional 3D graphics on Linux with my AMD HD7670 graphics
>>> card.  The neither the open source Radeon driver or the propriety AMD
>>> catalyst driver works properly.  So I'm forced to either go buy an
>>> NVidia card or run GNOME3 in the fall back mode (read low resolution and
>>> no 3D ).  In spite of Linus' rants about NVidia, their proprietary Linux
>>> drivers have never given me any problems.  On Windows my shiny new
>>> graphics card works just fine.  I really thought we were getting past
>>> the whole graphics card nonsense but I guess not.  I'm glad I got that
>>> off my chest.  I feel much better now :)
>>
>> When I bought my last computer, I paid $35 more to have Linux pre-installed on it.  This
>> was a linux compatibility verification only.
>> After I got it, I installed my own Ubuntu on it and blew away what they had done.
>>
>> My thinking was that if the computer vendor could not get a recent linux running properly
>> on the hardware, that my time was too valuable to even try the machine.
> Live and learn.  I already have Zareason and System76 on the radar for 
> my next system be it laptop or desktop.  I'll be more than willing to 
> fork out a few extra bucks to avoid the headache I'm currently dealing with.


Your next computer may not even be Intel compatible, could be a 4th generation Raspberry
Pi or Beaglebone.

Linux compatibility is assured in such a situation.  (I say that with full knowledge that
Microsoft is dating ARM.)

Our worst nightmare is that Microsoft buys ARM.


Dick