scratch team mailing list archive

[Amos Blanton <amos@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Kevin -

Hmm.... Someone mentioned that they often see packages with both .deb and
spec files, so I guess there is a way to make them coexist well but I don't
know it. No big deal though - it's fine if it references the tarball.

So for now the plan to check in the spec file in that directory sounds
great. If you can include some instructions briefly describing what other
rpm devs might need to know to make the package, that'd be really helpful.

re: lib / libexec - Changing it sounds good, we'll go with whatever you
think is best. That's not one of the locations that's hardcoded inside the
image, so either way.

So - after this I guess we should ask someone with a fedora system to test a
new build, and then if it checks out mostly ok, we'll make it available on
this page:

http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Scratch_on_Linux

Thanks Kevin!
Amos


On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:09 PM, <ksomervi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Hello,
> Sorry for not checking it in.  I've tried to come up with a clean way to
> build the rpm from the svn checkout, but haven't hit on anything that I
> like.  I'll check in the spec file tonight in {top_dir}/rpm/SPEC if that's
> ok.  To build the RPM, you need the tarfile and I was worried about
> version control.  Also, I did some testing with the Fedora rpms and the
> main squeak and the Fedora ones don't work on my CentOS install (I think I
> already told you that). Since squeak sticks stuff in /usr/lib/ should I
> change the rpm to follow this.  I think it's more correct to put plugins
> in /usr/libexec, but consistency is often better than correctness.
>
> ./ks
>
>
> > Glad to know the rpm works well! I've cc'ed Kevin, who created it.
> > And thanks for the feedback about the readme.  I haven't added the new
> > readme to the source package yet, but I've linked to it from the source
> > tarball on the Linux installer page. If you have any more tweaks feel
> free
> > to join the assembla team, check out the code, and make changes - or if
> > it's
> > easier just let me know and I'll tweak it.
> >
> > http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Scratch_on_Linux
> >
> > We've always just used .po files, even with the Windows and Mac versions
> -
> > I'm not sure if there is a reason for this, but I'll mention it to the
> > devs.
> >
> >
> > Let me know if you have any more suggestions - and thanks for testing!
> >
> > -Amos
> >
> >
> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:04 AM, andré <andre99b@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Hi Amos :
> >>
> >> It makes sense to avoid being too specific.  However the readme should
> >> mention using "make", as the alternatives likely expect a different file
> >> format.
> >> (That is definitely the case for "cmake", despite the similar name.)
> >> "make" is only a 1 M download, for anyone willing to compile who doesn't
> >> already have it on their system.
> >>
> >> I tested the rpm file.
> >> (Interestingly, if one opens it in an archive reader, one can see the
> >> installed file layout.  The date on the files is 2010-03-22.)
> >>
> >> It installs mostly ok.
> >> The program starts from the menu entry, which is in the correct
> >> location,
> >> but ...
> >> I checked with the readme info, and most files are installed in the
> >> correct
> >> location, except it installs files to /usr/libexec/ instead of
> >> /usr/lib/.
> >>
> >> As well, the translations are installed as *.po files, which contain the
> >> original language + comments.
> >> These are normally stripped to make the more efficient *.mo files.
> >> (Mentioned just in case it is not already planned.)
> >> If you like, I could convert the *.po files.
> >>
> >> By the way, I like how it automatically starts in the default system
> >> language. (french in my case.)
> >> Not rocket science, but something often overlooked.
> >>
> >>
> >> -André
> >>
> >>
> >> Amos Blanton a écrit :
> >>
> >>> André,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> I've added a bit of instructions about make to the readme and will
> >>> update
> >>> the package soon - but we don't want to get too specific, because there
> >>> are
> >>> so many different ways to do things. If they can't just type "make," we
> >>> will
> >>> have to rely on them to figure out how to compile things for their
> >>> particular platform. Of course, if you and others can help make an RPM
> >>> (and
> >>> because we already provide a .deb package), most people won't need to
> >>> worry
> >>> about this!
> >>>
> >>> btw : Kevin Somervil has been working on the rpm - you might try his
> >>> beta
> >>> version here:
> >>>
> >>> http://www.brokenlogo.com/downloads/scratch-1.4.0-beta2.i386.rpm <
> >>> http://www.brokenlogo.com/downloads/scratch-1.4.0-beta2.i386.rpm>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Hopefully he will check in his "spec" file to our assembla repository
> >>> soon, so it is easier for others to test / develop with it.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks!
> >>> Amos
> >>> Scratch Team
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 7:09 AM, andré <andre99b@xxxxxxxx <mailto:
> >>> andre99b@xxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>    Hi Amos :
> >>>
> >>>    At first glance, the readme looks great, it has a lot of useful
> >>> info.
> >>>    except ...
> >>>    1) It would be useful to add something like : (correct as necessary)
> >>>    ---
> >>>    If you need to compile a plugin :
> >>>    - put it in the build/ directory
> >>>    - enter:  make
> >>>    - the resulting compiled plugin will end with .xxx
> >>>    ---
> >>>    (By the way, one reason I raised the point about make is that
> >>>    sometimes another program is used with makefiles, e.g. cmake or
> >>>    dmake.)
> >>>
> >>>    2) It would be useful to note that the case of directory names
> >>>    must be exact.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>    As for an rpm package, I've been thinking of trying out the rpm
> >>>    creation utilities in the Mandriva Linux repository.
> >>>    It would be my first attempt.
> >>>
> >>>    -André
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>    Amos Blanton a écrit :
> >>>
> >>>        Hi André,
> >>>
> >>>        Thanks for writing. We agree - an rpm would be great! A
> >>>        helpful member of the community started work on this a while
> >>>        ago, but hasn't checked in their code quite yet. Hopefully
> >>>        this will be possible soon. If you know of others who'd like
> >>>        to help make an RPM, please invite them. The code is available
> >>>        via links here:
> >>>
> >>>        http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Linux_Installer
> >>>
> >>>        We made the tarball publically available in hopes that people
> >>>        with experience would step forward and help make an RPM. But
> >>>        perhaps we should include instructions on how to compile in
> >>>        the meantime. Here's a first draft of a readme file - please
> >>>        recommend any changes, and then I'll add it to the tarball.
> >>>
> >>>        README.txt
> >>>
> >>>        Scratch is written in Squeak, and runs on a Squeak virtual
> >>>        machine, included in the tarball as  "scratch_squeak_vm." For
> >>>        more information about squeak, see: http://www.squeak.org/
> >>>
> >>>        Since Scratch runs as an image on an interpreter, all that
> >>>        needs to be compiled are the necessary plugins, which can be
> >>>        done using the included makefile. The rest of the installation
> >>>        involves copying files to their correct locations:
> >>>
> >>>        /usr/lib/scratch - the Scratch.image file, and the squeak
> >>>        virtual machine ("scratch_squeak_vm.")
> >>>        /usr/lib/scratch/Plugins - plugins necessary for Scratch to
> >>>        run properly
> >>>
> >>>        The following directories must be found in these locations,
> >>>        because references to them are hard-coded within the
> >>>        Scratch.image file:
> >>>        /usr/share/scratch/Help - the help screen images, and the help
> >>>        html files.
> >>>        /usr/share/scratch/locale - translation .po files
> >>>        /usr/share/scratch/Media - image and sound files bundled with
> >>>        Scratch
> >>>        /usr/share/scratch/Projects - sample projects bundled with
> >>> Scratch
> >>>
> >>>        The "scratch" startup script shows how to execute the vm, and
> >>>        the necessary command line switches to indicate where the
> >>>        plugins can be found, and which sound plugin should be used.
> >>>        The included script uses the pulseaudio sound plugin by
> >>>        defauilt, but plugins are also available for alsa and oss -
> >>>        simply change the vm's command line switches to try different
> >>>        ones. Here's the script:
> >>>
> >>>        /usr/bin/scratch_squeak_vm \
> >>>        -plugins /usr/lib/scratch/Plugins \
> >>>        -vm-sound-pulse \
> >>>        /usr/lib/scratch/Scratch.image "${@}"
> >>>
> >>>        Scratch project files end in .sb, so you may want to register
> >>>        that filetype on your system. See the source code for the
> >>>        package at:
> >>>
> >>> https://www.assembla.com/spaces/scratchonlinux/trac_subversion_tool
> >>>         for more info.
> >>>
> >>>        ##end
> >>>
> >>>        Would this information constitute a decent readme, or would
> >>>        you recommend changes / additional info?
> >>>
> >>>        -Amos
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>        On Wed, Apr 28, 2010 at 9:10 AM, andré <andre99b@xxxxxxxx
> >>>        <mailto:andre99b@xxxxxxxx> <mailto:andre99b@xxxxxxxx
> >>>
> >>>        <mailto:andre99b@xxxxxxxx>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>           It would be nice if you had an RPM compiled package for
> >>>        Linux, for
> >>>           the Fedora/Suse/Mandriva distros (mine being Mandriva).  Or
> >>> at
> >>>           least a generic *.tar.gz compiled package.
> >>>           Many on non-Debian/Ubuntu Linux don't have the skills or
> >>>           inclination to compile from source.
> >>>           (Especially on more user-friendly distros like Mandriva.)
> >>>
> >>>           I've downloaded the scratch_1.4.0.1.tar.gz source package
> >>>        from the
> >>>           Linux page.
> >>>           It doesn't seem to include compile instructions.
> >>>           (I would have expected that documented in a readme file.)
> >>>           Please let me know if I should use something other than
> >>> "make".
> >>>
> >>>           By the way, I notice that there are 2 translations files for
> >>>           french, fr.po and and fr_CA.po.
> >>>           On reviewing the files, I see that none of the phrases to be
> >>>           translated touch the few differences between France and
> >>> Canada
> >>>           (which are primarily accent).
> >>>           (The best online reference for french technical terms is
> >>>        based in
> >>>           Canada.)
> >>>           For most of the differences between the 2 files, one (if
> >>>        not both)
> >>>           are clearly in error; the others generally depend on the
> >>>        context
> >>>           (which can only be determined by running the software).
> >>>           I would like to correct the translations (producing identical
> >>>           files), after compiling the program and verifying the
> >>> contexts.
> >>>           Also I would be interested in translating the help files
> >>> (into
> >>>           french).
> >>>
> >>>           Again, please let me know if I should use something other
> >>> than
> >>>           "make" to compile scratch.
> >>>
> >>>           André
> >>>        --         _____
> >>>        Amos
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> _____
> >>> Amos
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > _____
> > Amos
> >
>
>


-- 
_____
Amos