ubuntu-phone team mailing list archive

[Jens Grivolla <jens.grivolla@xxxxxxxxx>]

With no intention to bash the work the developers are doing, I agree that
there are currently some marketing problems with Ubuntu Touch devices that
are sold to end users.

I bought a bq M10 fully expecting it to not be as polished as an Android
device, but thinking it might be useful as a bit of a portable desktop
replacement. I expected something like a Raspberry Pi in desktop mode, with
a semi-functional touch interface to use it as a tablet. Unfortunately I
was wrong.

I also knew that it was a bit of a gamble and I was trying something still
somewhat experimental, and that's ok. I have been a Linux user for almost
20 years and am not afraid of having to figure things out and using the
command line for things that are not yet ready at the UI level.

My problems are two-fold:

First, I paid at least 50€ more for the Ubuntu Edition, waiting several
weeks for it to arrive, than I would have paid for the same tablet with
Android at the store next door. BQ support was unable to tell me whether
the hardware is the same (M10 FHD), and I still don't really know. I would
have gladly bought the Android M10, knowing that it is a supported
reference device for flashing experimental Ubuntu Touch builds on. I'm
still not sure how I feel about paying a lot more (290€ for the obligatory
pack with a case instead of 220€ for the bare tablet) for what is sold as
an end-user device, but really isn't. I have thought many times about
returning it and getting the Android version instead, but haven't done so
because I want to support UT.

Second, and that's the reason I flashed Android on it a few days ago (but
will try UT again in a few weeks) is that I found it to not currently work
for my geeky and not-so-geeky use cases. Last week, at a project meeting, I
needed to ssh into a server to fix things which I would then check through
a web interface. This failed in two ways, and made it very difficult for
me. Each time I switched between the terminal and the web browser, even for
a few seconds, my ssh connection got killed. And each time I switched to
the web browser, the page would reload, killing my session and all the work
I had been doing. The same thing would even happen when only switching tabs.

I tried the same thing on Android and it works perfectly. My ssh sessions
survive for hours, even when putting the tablet to sleep, and browser tabs
obviously do not reload arbitrarily.

I also found the tablet to be severely lacking as a media playing device,
with no VLC or other media players capable of reproducing most of the
videos I tried. On Android I get all the software I need.

For now, installing additional software, even without touch capability, is
also complicated to impossible, even when ARM ports for the RPi exist,
making it a very limited device for tinkerers or "power users" (although
that will hopefully change soon).

As I said, UT is interesting and I will check it regularly, but it should
be an option that people can try and help develop, not something sold at a
premium to end users.

Best,
Jens

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 5:46 PM, Joseph Liau <joseph@xxxxxxx> wrote:

> I might be wrong, and I often am but...
>
> On 2016-07-09 04:49 AM, Oliver Grawert wrote:
>
> hi,
> Am Samstag, den 09.07.2016, 13:17 +0200 schrieblinuxgehtned@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx:
>
>
> Think on it when you say it is ready for all. It is not really. It's
> only
> for developers or enthusiasts but really not for ALL. Will some of
> this
> points change this year? Or until the end of the second year on the
> market
> three months later?
>
> The marketing should really slow down its messages of readyness.
>
> can you point to a press release, announcement or mail where it has
> been claimed that it is ready for everyone ?
>
> I haven't seen any press release that claims anything for anyone. I think
> the issues is that we don't know who the devices are intended for.
> Perhaps there are some documents that ship with the pre-loaded devices?
> E.g. where to file bugs, why to file bugs, how to file bugs etc.
>
> We might need to do a better job on the documentation and explanation of
> where this project is at, where it's going, and what to expect when you opt
> in.
>
>  I think
> you need at least 50% more developers to not sleep against Android.
> With
> this not acceptable problems for a too long period then in some
> months.
> Please take a new developer to speed this biggest problems up.
>
> don't hold back, the code is out there, help fixing the issues you see,
> i am pretty sure nobody will turn down any patches if they fix problems
> ;)
>
>
> This is true that Ubuntu is an opt-in, participatory project. Sometimes
> that isn't correctly conveyed or received. We could put some more focus on
> getting people to understand the nature and power of this type of project,
> and the on-boarding system for those who want to get involved (It's not
> just software).
>
> I might just be terrible at web searching, but I could not find the code
> for ubuntu touch. It may be a documentation problem. That being said, I
> don't know how to code, so I would feel very left out if that was the only
> way to contribute.
>
> We can file bugs, and make suggestions, and influence the project in other
> ways, but I think it can be frustrating for some people who don't have the
> technical skills, and have their bugs overlooked or unattended.
> Understandably, it is difficult to address everything, but we still wonder
> what's going on behind the scenes.
>
>
> as you noticed, there is only so much manpower, but you can help to
> speed it up if you don't want to wait ...
>
> Resources may be limited, but they can also be focused. e.g. "This week's
> goal is to work on encryption. Everyone who is able, please put efforts
> there."
>
> There are essential items (i.e encryption) that could be focused on. We
> could get those done one at a time based on some kind of priority.  When
> there is a wild fire in a village, some people don't continue to work on
> doing the dishes. Everyone helps to take care of an urgent need.
>
> Again, I don't know how duties are carried out, and perhaps it's a
> documentation problem or an announcement issue.
>
> tl;dr
> I'm not a developer and I don't think like a developer, so I don't
> understand what's going on from a developer point of view. I probably need
> someone who is not a developer to explain some of these things. I only
> understand things in terms of "features" that exist or do not, and wonder
> why.
>
> There is obviously a lot getting done. I use ubuntu phone as my one and
> only mobile device in the wild, and I am thankful for what everyone has
> done so far :)
>
> I think a lot of the complaints are stemming from the huge gaping
> question: what is currently being worked on and why? At this point, it
> seems a communication problem. Trolls tend to lurk in the darkness. If we
> can shed more light on the situation, then we might be happier.
>
>
>
> ciao
> 	oli
>
>
>
>
>
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