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Re: My ideas

 

On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 12:45 PM, Bruno Girin <brunogirin@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On 03/01/12 18:25, Thomas Mashos wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 10:18 AM, Ian Santopietro<isantop@xxxxxxxxx>
>>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I don't doubt that this behaviour is already present in a lot of
>>>> households>  but as technology savvy users, we have to remember that we are
>>>> by nature>  early adopters of tech so what we find simple and intuitive to
>>>> use (such as>  Ubuntu) may be bewildering for others.
>>>
>>> I understand what you mean about early adoption by tech savvy users,
>>> but I should point out that I'm the only tech savvy user in the
>>> household, and that I don't really watch very much TV at all. This is
>>> universal behaviour at my house, and it wasn't influenced by me at
>>> all.
>>> Like I said, I expect we're a bit of a corner case, but if this sort
>>> of behaviour was scarce, I doubt that DVRs themselves would be nearly
>>> as widespread as they are now, as this is what they're best at.
>>>
>>>> In response to "As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very
>>>> hard to create a simple DVR program and use that for recording from an
>>>> input feed.", I disagree with this statement. It needs to be done
>>>> right, and really I think we need to use a solution that already
>>>> exists. Basic DVR functionality isn't extremely difficult, but it is
>>>> more than just recording (don't forget about scheduling, show
>>>> tracking, conflict resolution, space management, etc).
>>>
>>> Fair enough. I do agree that reusing an existing solution would be
>>> better. I probably should have used "implement" instead of "create" as
>>> it better conveys the general point.
>>>
>>> I think, ideally, that Ubuntu TV would be more than a MythTV frontend.
>>> I agree that MythTV would make an excellent media backend, but we want
>>> to do more with Ubuntu TV than just media. There could be a portion of
>>> it that would relay information from a MythTV backend, but we
>>> shouldn't limit ourselves to what MythTV can do.
>>>
>>> I also don't think that we should have a two machine dependency. By
>>> default, Ubuntu TV should be ready on its own, single piece of
>>> hardware, since that what is easiest to configure. There could be
>>> advanced settings for connecting to an external MythTV box, but it
>>> should not be a requirement.
>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 09:41, Thomas Mashos<thomas@xxxxxxxxxx>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 7:27 AM, Bruno Girin<brunogirin@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 03/01/12 14:50, Ian Santopietro wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't think channels will play a huge bearing on TV in the future.
>>>>>> Channels simply don't make any sense anymore to anyone except cable
>>>>>> companies. People will want to subscribe to a TV show and watch only
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> shows they want, rwather than pay for an entire channel and only four
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> five out of all of the shows each channel offers.
>>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with you that TV on demand of that sort is probably the future.
>>>>> But
>>>>> it needs to be as easy to use as today's live TV, where the simplicity
>>>>> of
>>>>> switching the box on and then pressing a number on the remote is all
>>>>> you
>>>>> have to do. This comes back to the original comment made by Thomas
>>>>> Söderberg
>>>>> about his folks finding MythTV difficult to use compared to a TV. The
>>>>> idea
>>>>> is to minimise the time and the number of interactions between
>>>>> switching the
>>>>> device on and being sat in the sofa watching the show you want.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> This sort of behaviour is already present. No one in my house watches
>>>>>> live
>>>>>> TV anymore. Instead we have the shows we want to watch set up to
>>>>>> record, and
>>>>>> we watch them after they get recorded. This may be a bit extreme of a
>>>>>> case,
>>>>>> but I'm pretty sure most people with DVR equipment do this at least a
>>>>>> little
>>>>>> bit. It makes more sense for these people to simply purchase the show
>>>>>> they
>>>>>> want, then watch them as new episodes become available, rather than
>>>>>> paying
>>>>>> for an entire channel.
>>>>>>
>>>>> I don't doubt that this behaviour is already present in a lot of
>>>>> households
>>>>> but as technology savvy users, we have to remember that we are by
>>>>> nature
>>>>> early adopters of tech so what we find simple and intuitive to use
>>>>> (such as
>>>>> Ubuntu) may be bewildering for others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, if supporting live TV is a show stopper in terms of complexity,
>>>>> then
>>>>> I agree we shouldn't pursue this. But that doesn't preclude thinking
>>>>> hard
>>>>> about the user interface to make sure that its interaction model is as
>>>>> simple as the live TV interaction model. For example, one aspect of
>>>>> Unity
>>>>> that works extremely well and that would make complete sense for a TV
>>>>> is the
>>>>> use of the numerical key shortcuts (Super+0-9) to launch an
>>>>> application. By
>>>>> re-using that concept to enable users to quickly select a show when
>>>>> they
>>>>> first start UbuntuTV can give you a similar interaction model as live
>>>>> TV.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very hard to create a
>>>>>> simple
>>>>>> DVR program and use that for recording from an input feed.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Possibly, I can't comment as I don't know what it would involve but my
>>>>> experience is that each time I hear the phrase "it shouldn't be too
>>>>> hard
>>>>> to..." in technology, it usually ends up being a major endeavour, which
>>>>> obviously doesn't prevent me from saying this on a regular basis :-)
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bruno
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv
>>>>> Post to     : ubuntu-tv@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv
>>>>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>>
>>>> In response to "As for interfacing with cable, it wouldn't be very
>>>> hard to create a simple DVR program and use that for recording from an
>>>> input feed.", I disagree with this statement. It needs to be done
>>>> right, and really I think we need to use a solution that already
>>>> exists. Basic DVR functionality isn't extremely difficult, but it is
>>>> more than just recording (don't forget about scheduling, show
>>>> tracking, conflict resolution, space management, etc).
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Thomas Mashos
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv
>>>> Post to     : ubuntu-tv@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-tv
>>>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ian Santopietro
>>>
>>> Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.
>>> See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html
>>>
>>> "Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast
>>>  Ofer middangeard monnum sended"
>>>
>>> Pa gur yv y porthaur?
>>>
>>> Public GPG key (RSA):
>>>
>>> http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x412F52DB1BBF1234
>>
>> I agree, and I've said all for a long time (not here though) that the
>> power of MythTV is in the backend, and that the frontend feels dated
>> in comparison to other alternatives. I also agree that this needs to
>> be a single box solution. I don't think you will get any good DVR
>> functionality inside a TV (or a small low power box). Perhaps DVR
>> functionality should be considered advanced/extra and require the
>> extra box?
>>
> Agreed it should be a single machine install with the option for advanced
> users to only install a front-end or a back-end. A bit like the partitioning
> options in the current installer: default to a full install but have an
> advanced alternative.
>
> So basically what we're looking at creating is something MythTV-like, with a
> swish front-end + back-end model, the back-end being either MythTV or MythTV
> + additional stuff? Shall we start a feature list? I'm happy to maintain it.
>
> Bruno

We've had a feature list for a few months (
http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/UbuntuTV ) as well as an Issues list (
http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/UbuntuTV-Issues ). You (and anyone else
interested) might want to join #ubuntu-tv on Freenode.

-- 
Thomas Mashos


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