ubuntu-manual team mailing list archive

[Jim Connett <jimandmarcy@xxxxxxxxx>]

Sorry for reviving a thread almost 10 days old, but I think it's good to do
so in light of the fact that we are in the editing phase of the manual.
Hannie's original opinion brings to us a great reminder as editors (and
authors) that we need to be sure to use the terminology currently being
employed by Canonical to refer to different elements of Ubuntu. This means
we should only see a passing reference to the word "Nautilus" in the 13.04
manual, and we should be sure as editors that we are using the term "Files"
to describe what once was called Nautilus. Now that I've edited the
"Advanced Topics" section, I, too, agree with Hannie that this element of
the GUI system is very hard to describe to a beginner. I also agree with
Patrick's excellent observation that we should keep our personal
preferences in this mailing list and out of the manual (have I mentioned
that I'm really getting tired of the brown default GUI interface with each
Ubuntu distribution? :) ). We need to focus our efforts at this time to
clearly communicating the elements and features we find in 13.04 and let
the community drive the changes. In a way, we're reporters...we stick with
the facts!

--Jim



On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 11:30 AM, John <c7p.admin@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> On 03/20/2013 09:49 AM, Hannie Dumoleyn wrote:
>
>> There is one thing we should keep in mind: the Ubuntu Manual is mainly
>> for beginners. We should not make the advanced topics too comprehensive, at
>> least that is my personal opinion. Perhaps in the future we could make a
>> special manual for advanced users, or is that too ambitious? As a team, we
>> do have the experience now.
>> Hannie
>>
>> Op 20-03-13 00:26, Thomas Corwin schreef:
>>
>>> That excerpt could potentially go into the Advanced Topic Chapter. It
>>> could go into the "Introduction to the terminal", right after "What is the
>>> terminal?". It would be titled: "Comparing Terminals". (Just a thought)
>>>
>>> Have a good night!
>>> Thomas Corwin
>>>
>>> On Mar 19, 2013, at 7:21 PM, "Patrick Dickey" <pdickeybeta@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>  I think the goal is to make it as seamless of a transition for Windows
>>>> and Mac users as possible. Which means they have to "dumb it down"
>>>> enough for the user to feel comfortable. Kind of like crawling before
>>>> you walk, so to speak. The real power behind Linux has always been the
>>>> command line (IMHO), and that's what separates it from Windows/Mac.
>>>> Mainly this is because Microsoft (and I'm guessing Apple as well) have
>>>> removed features from the command line. My impression is they did it
>>>> because the features were dangerous, and they wanted to make sure the
>>>> user did it through a GUI, where they could control it's use. If you
>>>> look at DOS 5.x, DOS 6.x, Windows 95/98, and Windows XP (check the
>>>> options available in the Windows directories as opposed to what's
>>>> available on the DOS disks), you'll see how they removed some of the
>>>> power or at least hid it.
>>>>
>>>> I'm not sure where in the manual that would fit (if it would at all),
>>>> but it could be something to add in the comparison between Ubuntu and
>>>> Windows. Ubuntu is a great place for people to dip their feet in, so to
>>>> speak. I've got a Fedora installation, but honestly haven't paid
>>>> attention to how Files handles things there, as I typically use the
>>>> right click copy/cut/paste out of box. Next time I boot into it, I'll
>>>> have to check all of these things out there.
>>>>
>>>> I think the most important thing is that we don't let our feelings
>>>> towards what Canonical has done with Ubuntu make it into the manual
>>>> itself. Otherwise, we risk turning people off to Linux, and we
>>>> definitely risk turning people away from the manual.
>>>>
>>>> Have a great day.:)
>>>> Patrick.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, 2013-03-19 at 20:18 +0100, John Cave wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> To be honest I'm not really a fan of Ubuntu any longer - everything has
>>>>> been dumbed down so all you have to do is type what you want to do. I
>>>>> don't like it. Leave apple to do that, I say. I'm not a fan of Fuduntu
>>>>> for ease of use and Sabayon for hard-coreness.
>>>>>
>>>>> I say bring back the thinking that a user has a brain!
>>>>> John Cave
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Mar 19, 2013, at 10:07 AM, Hannie Dumoleyn wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Using  and describing Files (formerly Nautilus) is a real struggle.
>>>>>> The
>>>>>> menu bar now only contains the menu "Files". Other menus like Edit,
>>>>>> View, Go, Bookmarks and Help, which could be found in the menu bar in
>>>>>> Nautilus 3.4, are now placed on the toolbar in two dropdown menus:
>>>>>> View
>>>>>> options and Location options. And the only way to Copy/Move is by
>>>>>> right-clicking on a file or folder.
>>>>>> I find it far less useful (eg. no more F3), and not very logical. I
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> changed the section on the file manager to describe the new situation,
>>>>>> but I am far from happy with it. I hope users will get a better file
>>>>>> manager in future versions of Ubuntu.
>>>>>> Sorry for my moaning, just felt like sharing this with you :(
>>>>>> Hannie
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ______________________________**_________________
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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> I agree with you on that.
> I assume that on future releases we can do that too.
> As it seems Ubuntu will become a rolling release, so we'll have time
> between LTS releases,
> to work on manuals with other focuses and goals, if we have interest and
> time.
> We can discuss about it in more detail in the near future ;)
>
> --John
>
>
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