unity-design team mailing list archive

[Alex Launi <alex.launi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Jan 10, 2013, at 10:26 AM, Yann Brelière <yannbreliere@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Like Jonathan said, I think Jeremy Bicha's suggestions were good: I like the idea of having additional integration for my mails, music, etc. But I don't want to clutter my launcher just because I have a tab open.

Why not? What about the icon at the bottom of your launcher bothers you? Do you think that your opinion is a reflection of the general case? I'm curious, because never has a launcher icon caused me a second thought. 

Designers (hopefully) reading this thread, what has testing revealed here? Are people generally territorial over their launchers?

> 
> Visiting a page shouldn't open a launcher item, but opening it from the launcher explicitly could launch an independent chrome-less browser window. There might be other suggestions for integration with the launcher, but currently, it's painful.

How do you propose getting that icon on the launcher in the first place if it doesn't appear when you open a tab? There seems to be a bit of a chicken-egg problem here, or could you elaborate on how you see this behavior working.

> 
> If I could add/remove a launcher for GMail (currently, removing the launcher icon closes the tab, it's very frustrating), it would be great. But now, it's all or nothing. I can't have GMail's dektop notifications without having the launcher icon always visible. I can't get notifications and soundmenu integration for Grooveshark without having an icon popping in the launcher each time I open it.

This is a good bug, thank you.

> 
> I pin my GMail, G+, calendar, etc as app tabs in Firefox because it allows me to keep them open and always visible without taking too much space in the tabs strip. So even though I would love better desktop integration for these, I don't use it, as it has the opposite effect: taking a lot of space somewhere else.
> 
> > having items bob in and out of the Launcher just because you're currently on a particular Web site is asinine.
> 
> About the main topic of the sound menu, I agree with everything mpt said: if a youtube tab is open (either by mistake or because I'm watching one), it should be controllable and visible in the soundmenu.
> 
> 
> Yann

My conclusions of your criticisms are essentially that the launcher behavior is where most of your complaints wrt webapps are from. you want the other integration points, but you feel a territorialism over launcher real estate. You feel as though maybe we're invoking imminent domain on you. This seems like an easy fix. Do you code?

> 
> 
> On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 4:03 PM, Alex Launi <alex.launi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Well do you have any good suggestions for how to fix the issues you've encountered? Or any good design suggestions to make it a bit less of a mess? What about with regard to the topic of this thread, any interesting ideas for fitting into the sound menu more scalably?
> 
> Alex
> 
> On Jan 9, 2013, at 3:19 PM, Jonathan Meek <shrouded.cloud@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
>> A bit late, but I would like to add my own thoughts to this: I absolutely agree with Mr. Bicha about web-apps in 12.10 (having finally downloaded it to test the new toolkit). They are a bit of a mess. And I, as a seasoned user, find their launcher behavior almost indecipherable given the context. Am I just visiting a fancy browser window or am I actually using something that is supposed to be its own thing? And getting them to install was a hassle and no feedback for when it didn't work... Tried to install GMail three times before it worked with no feedback as to why it failed the previous times. And plus one to the completely chromeless argument.
>> 
>> Pandora just suddenly showed in my sound menu unexpectedly as well. I guess I'm mostly trying to say what Jeremy said: a good start but far from perfect.
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Jeremy Bicha <jbicha@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> On 13 December 2012 09:57, Alex Launi <alex.launi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> > Like any software, webapps will always be incomplete. The implementation
>> > of the integration was not poor (at least I don't like to think so), but
>> > there were features that got de-scoped for 12.10. Chromeless browsing in
>> > Firefox was one item. There is a chromeless mode for Chromium, it exists
>> > in 12.10. Chromeless mode does not, however, prevent you from having
>> > multiple tabs. You could have 10 instances of Facebook, or YouTube in
>> > one of these chromeless browser windows. Chromeless mode is accessed
>> > when you have a launcher icon and launch a new instance of a webapp from
>> > it. Integration should always work from the browser though, how else
>> > would you find that a webapp exists?
>> 
>> I think that Firefox or Chromium should prompt for installing webapps
>> like it does.
>> 
>> Without chromeless mode, I (as a user) see webapps as being just fancy
>> bookmarks that may also have notification or indicator support. I
>> think chromeless mode *should* prevent you from opening multiple tabs
>> because a standalone webapp is not a full-featured web browser (that's
>> just the backend, an implementation detail). Links to external domains
>> (not white-listed in the particular webapp config) should open in your
>> regular web browser because a webapp should act like a native app as
>> much as possible.
>> 
>> For me, proper chromeless mode is an essential part of webapps so
>> that's why I was disappointed with 12.10's implementation (I don't
>> mean to hurt the feelings of those who spent months working on the
>> feature; I expected that that feature would instead land in 13.04).
>> 
>> Jeremy
>> 
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