unity-design team mailing list archive

["pjssilva@xxxxxxxxx" <pjssilva@xxxxxxxxx>]

I think Chad has a point with the vanishing menus.

I had never thought to much about it, but my eyes are much faster than my
hands. If I want to use the menu the first thing I do is to move my eyes to
the top bar, they arrive there and see an empty space. I feel slightly
frustrated. Then my mouse pointer reaches the top so that the menu is
revealed. Now I feel I relief for being able to see what are the top menu
options. Only then I can move the mouse pointer towards the right menu. If
the menu was always visible I could aim at the right place in my first
movement.

For me, this frustration followed by relief feeling, that happens every
single time I try to use a menu, is very bad. I am pretty sure I'll regret
deeply being made aware of it after reading Chad's email.

How to other feel? Don't you mind to be "forced" to move the mouse up
before aiming at the right menu frustrating?

best,

Paulo

Obs: Unfortunately, I see that it is not trivial to change to a "always on"
behavior for the global menu. Where would the information displayed in the
windows bar appear in maximized windows. I don't have a Mac at hand here to
see how they solved that problem.


2013/1/29 Chad M. Germann <cgermann@xxxxxxxxx>

>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: unity-design-bounces+cgermann=gmail.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
> unity-design-bounces+cgermann=gmail.com@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
> Chow Loong Jin
> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 10:28 PM
> To: unity-design@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [Unity-design] end user ajustable Global menu Blacklist
>
> (Disclaimer: I'm not a Unity developer, nor am I involved in its design,
> so please don't fault them for my opinions.)
>
> On 29/01/2013 06:09, Chad Germann wrote:
> >     Let’s face it People have yelled about Unity’s Vanishing global
> > menu. And it seems to fall on Deaf or stubborn ears. So we need
> > another fix because the option to let users let it keep showing is
> > probably not in the cards and, purposed “fix”
> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/682788  involves an inconsistent
> > behavior.  And out right ignores the option users have been //Asking
> > for//
>
> >Irrational yelling falling on deaf/stubborn ears is nothing new. When
> users ask for behaviours that they're used to, rather than behaviours that
> are intrinsically easier to >use, with either weak or no empirical evidence
> to back their arguments, the right course of action is naturally to ignore
> them.
>
> First of all The Burdon of Proof falls upon the person enacting change and
> going against years of convention. Secondly, I have yet to see rational
> proof that making the menu vanish is " are intrinsically easier to use" in
> fact I find that it is exactly the contrary and the muscle memory argument
> is invalid because every application is different. Becides how is Let the
> user choose if they want this behavior on their machine or not Irrational?
>
>   >For office applications like Libreoffice, I guess there's a balance
> between
>    >keyboard and mouse usage, but on the other hand, can you really do
> much work
>    >on these applications when they're not maximized? And even when it's
> not,
>    >it's really not that hard to move your mouse to the top of the screen.
> I
>    >really don't want to bring up Fitt's law again, but slamming your
> pointer to
>    >the top of the screen does seem a lot easier than trying to aim for a
> thin
>    >menubar.
>
> Maximized or not that menu bar is disappearing. And While yes it is easier
> to hit the edge of a screen it is also better to see your target aiming
>  not just drag up to see the menu  now move my pointer to the right menu I
> wanted it is an extra step. That would not be necessary if that menu bar
> was always visible up there.
>
> >Let's also not forget that Mac OS is very popular for media editing, and
> they use a global menu, so it really isn't as bad as you claim it to be
>
> Apple's implementation does not go *poof* when the pointer is not over it
>  I love the Global menu on the mac because it is better with Fitts law and
> does not
>  vanish.
>
> >I think a global menu blacklist of sorts already exists somewhere. And if
> you really don't want the global menu at all, just remove the
> indicator-appmenu package.
>
> I think you missed my point I love Global menu just Unity's Vanishing
> behavior leaves much to be desired for productivity. I suggested
> blacklisting these apps because being able to see the menu on them boosts
> productivity.
>
>
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-- 
Paulo José da Silva e Silva
Professor Associado, Dep. de Matemática Aplicada
(Associate Professor, Applied Mathematics Dept.)
State University of Campinas - Brazil

e-mail: pjssilva@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx Web: http://www.ime.usp.br/~pjssilva