torios team mailing list archive

["Ali/amjjawad" <amjjawad@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Nio and all,


On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 7:28 PM, Nio Wiklund <nio.wiklund@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Den 2016-01-04 kl. 13:13, skrev Ali/amjjawad:
> > Hi George and everyone else,
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 4, 2016 at 10:39 PM, George DiceGeorge
> > <dicegeorge@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:dicegeorge@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
> >
> >     maybe you misunderstand me,
> >     http://torios.dicenews.com/
> >     is only set up as a temporary address
> >     until torios.net <http://torios.net> or torios.top etc
> >     are pointed there,
> >     which ould take five minutes.
> >
> >     Its provided by http://www.hatters.org.uk/
> >
> >
> > Indeed I understood and that is why I sent more than one email to
> > explain the situation and make things clear. We don't need temporary
> > solutions. While it might seems weird/odd but I prefer our website to be
> > down rather than waste time and energy on building a temporary website
> > that might serve us few days.
> >
> > You see, we have waited for so long to have a decent website. I'm
> > personally not interested in temporary solutions and I think Nio agrees
> > with me.
> >
>
> Hi Ali, George and all other toriosadores,
>

Thank you for your email :)


>
> @ Ali and George, please try to understand each other :-)
>

Will sure do ;)


>
> @ everybody,
>
> George describes how his offer is likely to work for a long time, and
> that we can point any web address to it.
>

Given that:

   1. I have never heard of such 3rd party or organization before.
   2. While most likely only very few here know about Kris, I have worked
   with him for 'more' than years and he was so kind and so helpful to me
   while my former mentor let me down more than once, Kris was always there to
   help me FREE of charge. However, this time he can't do the 'free' thing
   again, it should be paid. Despite that fact, he has decreased the price for
   me AND improved his hosting plans. I mean, what could be better than this?
   3. If the host is trust worthy + there will be cPanel + a dedicated
   person to build the website + maintain it + access to all those who are
   involved = for me, I care less where the website is going to be hosted.

Please everyone, try to 'understand' my point.

It's really hard sometimes to explain something by emails. Keep in mind,
we're not seeing each other and English might not be the native language
for some here.


>
> Ali describes how important it is to have a long-term solution.


Indeed. That's very important IMHO to:

   1. reduce hassle.
   2. reduce problems.
   3. reduce pain and headache.
   4. increase productivity.
   5. Stable option.
   6. And more ..




> He
> thinks a commercial solution is more long-term than that of a voluntary
> organisation.
>

Not exactly. Just to make sure we're on the same page.

I have tried the FREE and Voluntary plan.
I have good and VERY BAD experience at the same time.

ToriOS and Kibo are two example of the very bad experience I had.

Ubuntu and all the official flavours I have worked with (Lubuntu, Xubuntu
and Ubuntu GNOME) are using Canonical resources. Sadly, we're not an
official flavour so we can't use any of these.

Whenever money is involved, I admit it is a sensitive topic but I have
seen, yet again, two types:
The good and the bad.

Lubuntu's main developer refused over and over again to ask for donation
for Lubuntu.

Ubuntu GNOME's main developer AND Alan Pope from Canonical think that's
good idea:
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-gnome/2016-January/003710.html

I think whenever money is involved, we gain 2 advantages that you CAN NOT
and WILL NOT have with the 'free' solutions:

   - the company or people you're paying to, there is NO WAY they will
   delete your DNS and leave you without a website for months simply because,
   you paid for them. YES, someone I am NOT going to name has deleted my DNS
   records and I've been without torios.net and kibo.computer for ages! You
   can't see similar drama with PAID services.
   - Whenever someone is going to pay, he/she will pay 'more' attention to
   what he/she has paid for. I am building a community here before anything
   else. The more people involved, the better. With free solutions, people
   don't care that much and please, I'm talking from 6 years of experience
   here :)

Now, I hope it's even more clear to everyone :)



> I think that it is important that a central person of ToriOS owns the
> web address. This is solved by Ali with torios.top.
>

Indeed. We have done 2 mistakes:

   1. torios.org was owned and maintained by William who has disappeared
   and still.
   2. torios.net is owned by someone who has deleted the DNS record and
   because we followed his advice and taken his free solution, we remained and
   still without a website until this very moment.

So, now the founder of ToriOS owns the domain of ToriOS project. Problem #1
is solved :)



>
> I'm not sure a one-person or two-person company is likely to stay in
> business longer than a voluntary organisation, that has already survived
> for some years. At this moment I do not 'agree more' with either of you.
>

It depends. That's something no human on earth can know for sure. Anything
could happen whether bad or good and we can't build our actions nor goals
on that, IMHO.

Point is, we need to go for the best solution. Sometimes, there is no "the
best", there is "better". Sometimes, we need to go for the option that will
offer 51% good and 49% bad.

Some other times we might go for 50:50 option.

It depends, really.

But yes, I see your point Nio ...


>
> Assuming nobody else is ready to pay now, I can afford £36 (36 pounds)
> and can promise to pay for the first year. But, one year from now, if
> nobody else is willing to pay for at least part of the second year, I
> would conclude, that nobody else is interested enough in that solution
> for ToriOS, and I might stop paying for it.
>

Fair enough but do you mean you might stop paying for it this year? or the
next year?!




>
> ---
> > I am NOT yet sure which package is good for us? assuming starter is
> > good enough:
> > 3 Pound/Month
> > 36 Pound/Year
> ---
>
> @ all other toriosadores,
>
> ToriOS needs input from more people in this discussion in order to find
> a solution that is good enough. Please tell us what *you* think :-)
>
> Best regards
> Nio
>

Thank you so much, Nio :)

Your 'detailed' email is great and amazing and I liked it :)


@Everyone
Can we please move forward? we can't discuss this forever, right?!
We need to make some progress ...

-- 
Remember: "All of us are smarter than any one of us."

Best Regards,
Ali/amjjawad <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/amjjawad>

*http://kibo.computer <http://kibo.computer>* - http://torios.net - Ubuntu
GNOME <http://ubuntugnome.org/>